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Thread: Our big, fun Iraq discussion thread

  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by Borderland View Post
    This is the latest from secretary Pompeo. I don't know, I suppose you could call that the public eye...maybe. Or maybe it's just a bunch of smoke and mirrors.


    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...-troops-093961
    It’s your opinion that buttresses your argument? I’m seriously trying to parse your logic and I cannot do so.
    #RESIST
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  2. #282
    Member TGS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GardoneVT View Post
    I dont give a shit about their S300s,and neither does the USAF.

    That being said, the Iranians have been able to maintain their 1970s and 80s stock to a functional level thanks to covert arms deals. Just because their assets are old doesn't make them useless, nor does our technolgical advances equal automatic victory. Public relations aside Desert Storm wasn't a walkover, nor was OIF. Invading Iran won't be either.
    You don't give a shit about S300s? Because you based your argument on them before.

    Desert Storm wasn't a walkover? Are you fucking retarded? It was a complete overmatch and decisive victory on such a landslide that there's few comparisons in history. We voluntarily stopped destroying Iraqi military convoys out of humanitarian concern, because it was that unfair of a fight. The invasion of Iraq was a complete walkover as well.

    You seriously think the Iranian military would provide more resistance in a conventional war, just because they have some airplanes and tanks from the 70s and 80s which, regardless of being unable to upgrade to modern standards, they've been able to keep barely functional due to black market deals for parts?

    Do you ever look at what you write and think, "I'm fucking dumb as hell," or does the need to be contrarian all the time just override that thought from the get go?
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer
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  3. #283
    Let’s stay civil.
    #RESIST
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  4. #284
    Abducted by Aliens Borderland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleLebowski View Post
    Have you heard of “satcom”?
    Yeah, Used to work with Trimble and dod navigation constellation a few years ago. I left out the
    Last edited by Borderland; 01-05-2020 at 02:56 PM.
    In the P-F basket of deplorables.
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  5. #285
    Quote Originally Posted by TGS View Post
    Desert Storm wasn't a walkover? Are you fucking retarded? It was a complete overmatch and decisive victory on such a landslide that there's few comparisons in history. We voluntarily stopped destroying Iraqi military convoys out of humanitarian concern, because it was that unfair of a fight. The invasion of Iraq was a complete walkover as well.
    Desert Storm coalition official casualties of killed or wounded ; 1,518
    OIF coalition + contractors official casualties of killed or wounded; 39,145

    Quote Originally Posted by TGS View Post
    You seriously think the Iranian military would provide more resistance in a conventional war, just because they have some airplanes and tanks from the 70s and 80s which, regardless of being unable to upgrade to modern standards, they've been able to keep barely functional due to black market deals for parts?
    I don’t know who pissed in your Wheaties this morning, but age ain’t nuthin but a number. We have B-52s predating the Kennedy administration still flying today. Guess what , Kim Jun Jackass still shuts his yap when we rotate them to Guam. Because build date won’t mean shit when his bunker gets crushed by high explosive.
    The Minority Marksman.
    "When you meet a swordsman, draw your sword: Do not recite poetry to one who is not a poet."
    -a Ch'an Buddhist axiom.
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  6. #286
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    The B-52s are continually updated. They don't fly with 70's equipment and without structural enhancements.
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  7. #287
    Modding this sack of shit BehindBlueI's's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0ddl0t View Post
    Are they really foreign? Or do they have a legitimate claim to the land...
    Flesh that out for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by 0ddl0t View Post
    From the moral perspective of the ethic of reciprocity and the Randian derivation "conflicts do not exist among men who do not desire the unearned," I'm willing to surrender all of the economy that we have not freely earned. Anything else strikes me akin to a robber demanding to cease hostilities without returning his loot.
    And when Russia and it's proxies take them? At what point are we irrelevant to the world and up for grabs?

    Quote Originally Posted by 0ddl0t
    We obviously would not have been as prosperous. This is the grain of truth in the liberal white/american privilege theory. Those twin towers probably would never have been built without the US ensuring it had access to cheap middle eastern oil.
    How's the Cold War play out without that prosperity? How's it look if the USSR/Warsaw Pact had it instead? Would the world be a better place? Deal with the consequences of your hypothetical for us.

    Quote Originally Posted by 0ddl0t
    I never said our economic war was unjustified, just that their bombing of Pearl Harbor was not some unprovoked attack as is the popular myth.
    "Popular myth" irrelevant to conversation. You said if we stayed home people would leave us alone. We stayed home. You then used our "economic war" as the reason we were attacked. Should we have continued to supply the imperial Japanese war machine to avoid conflict with Japan? Would that have not made us enemies of Korea and China? That's my question to you, not what's the popular myth and in light of your supposed belief in self-determination.

    [QUOTE0ddl0t]Attempting to capture "the holy land" is a bit more than a border war in my estimation[/QUOTE]

    You're free to look at a map and see how deep an incursion "the holy land" was into Islamic held territories.
    Last edited by BehindBlueI's; 01-05-2020 at 03:19 PM.
    Sorta around sometimes for some of your shitty mod needs.
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  8. #288
    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    Flesh that out for me.
    Do you believe it will be anything other than "from their prospective we are the bad guys! So actually it's all our fault" ?

    -Cory
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  9. #289
    Hokey / Ancient JAD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephanie B View Post
    Anybody?
    I am a nobody and know nothing. I would think that there are two levels of accomplishment we could shoot for. The first is to make the leadership of Iran think that taking more action against the US (including continued development of their nuclear ambitions) is too expensive. The second is to weaken them enough to cause their many enemies to destroy them completely.

    It is all bridge painting. If we check them, we will have to stay aggressive to remind them, and they will work hard to forget. If we destroy them, bigger assholes will take their place.
    Ignore Alien Orders
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  10. #290
    Site Supporter 0ddl0t's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by farscott View Post
    I am of the opinion that genocide is not winning; it is a crime against humanity. Killing terrorists is one thing; killing innocent men, women and children whose only crime was to be part of a "race" to be eliminated is something else. It would be, even if it worked, a short-term fix as we would have proven ourselves to be just as bad as Saddam Hussein and Adolf Hilter. It would definitely be an example of being on the wrong side of history as well as the antithesis of what we as Americans want to be. It would prove our critics to be correct and we would be a pariah among nations.
    We are (inadvertently, accidentally, and collaterally) killing innocent women and children now. War isn't clean and leveling a few cities to achieve lasting peace is less bad than having hundreds of thousands unnecessarily die each year in perpetuity.

    But getting the f out and not having to make these decisions is best (or least bad) of all options.

    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    Flesh that out for me.
    Are they existing tribes that have been at war with each other for thousands of years despite western attempts to draw boundaries? Or are they true outsiders?

    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    And when Russia and it's proxies take them? At what point are we irrelevant to the world and up for grabs?
    Let them try. Maybe they'll bring peace to the region, maybe they'll destroy their own empire in the attempt...

    How's the Cold War play out without that prosperity? How's it look if the USSR/Warsaw Pact had it instead? Would the world be a better place? Deal with the consequences of your hypothetical for us.
    If we weren't expanding our influence around the globe, we wouldn't have had a cold war.

    "Popular myth" irrelevant to conversation. You said if we stayed home people would leave us alone. We stayed home.
    By "stay home" I also mean remain neutral. Embargoing a country is not "staying home."

    You then used our "economic war" as the reason we were attacked. Should we have continued to supply the imperial Japanese war machine to avoid conflict with Japan? Would that have not made us enemies of Korea and China? That's my question to you, not what's the popular myth and in light of your supposed belief in self-determination.
    Choosing not to sell supplies to Japan while they were conquering others was reasonable.

    Choosing not to supply belligerents in the middle east would also be reasonable. And if one of them then attacked us, retaliation would be justified.

    Remaining in conflict which ostensibly began because a couple planes were hijacked long after everyone involved has been killed just because our continued involvement keeps creating new enemies is insane. But that's our current policy. We didn't break the middle east. Its been broken. We have no responsibility to fix it. Let's get out and let them try and sort things out.
    Last edited by 0ddl0t; 01-05-2020 at 03:38 PM.
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