The Semi-Unofficial Pistol-Forum Car geek, gearhead, hot rodder, and vehicle thread

[Doc_Glock]

I'm kind of kicking around going to look at a Porsche Cayenne when I'm in the market next. I penciled out a 2021 Corvette LT2, and while I could do it by financing for 48 months pretty comfortably (and trading in my Camaro and emptying my next car fund) I just don't think it's worth it. I end up driving my truck a lot more than my Camaro as it is. Between weather considerations, pot hole handling ability, need to be able to do some very light off roading to get to my shooting spot or a given trailhead and I end up putting 3k miles a year on my Camaro, give or take 1k. The Corvette would see maybe 10-20% less than that due to being a 2 seater. It's a lot of money to have tied up in something I'd drive so little, and I look at the opportunity costs and just can't justify it.


At least on paper, a Cayenne seems like it checks a lot of boxes for me. Enough ground clearance for most logging trails/fire roads, cross a small ditch, drive through a field, climb out of a midwest pothole. Enough ride height to see better in traffic, which was something I didn't like about the C6 and C7 Corvette I test drove. The turbo is definitely fast enough to be fun. Fuel economy for road trips is on par with my Camaro.

It seems like kind of a "do it all" where I can drive it year round but still have sportscar level fun/performance. No shifting my own gears, though.

This is definitely in the embryonic stages, but given the Porsche love here I thought I'd ask if the Cayenne is a reasonable thing to own or if it's a money pit/reliability nightmare.

My brother in law in Southern California got a couple year old CPO Cayenne and absolutely adores it as the best car he’s ever had. That is after about three months of ownership. He found a pretty good deal as well for it.

[JRB]

So exactly how closely related is Porsche to VW on the mechanical end of things? Same designers, same annoying hard-to-disconnect electrical connectors, same way-overdesigned everything? I don't mean overstrengthened, I mean just plain annoyingly pain-in-the-butt to perform a certain service as compared to the average Japanese counterpart? I *hate* working on VW's. If Porsche design philosophy is rooted in VW, then I'm out.

In that case I need a recommendation on the closest Japanese counterpart to the Cayenne, not that I expect there's anything out there to truly equal it. But I could see, as mentioned above, replacing both my Forester and my V6 Accord with one vehicle that could do both things well.

Porsche doesn't cheap out on pointless things that cause major problems anywhere near as much as VW does. Wrenching on them in general is not the same as wrenching on any old car, but really, everything's the same piece of shit as anything else these days. If you will work on a Porsche, buying proper tools to match its specific needs are lifechanging in how much easier it will make basic jobs. Be willing to do the research, find the factory service documentation (when possible) and do some internetting to research how to tackle a job.
If you just dive in expecting to find a Toyota 22R-E, you will be pissed off and hate it. But that goes for just about anything made since 2015 or so anyway, so times they are a-changin' and all that.

My brother in law in Southern California got a couple year old CPO Cayenne and absolutely adores it as the best car he’s ever had. That is after about three months of ownership. He found a pretty good deal as well for it.

The sports car purist in me really, desperately wanted to hate the Cayenne's very existence for a long time. But then I drove a 2013 Cayenne Turbo S... and now I get it. It delivers a combination of utility, refinement, and sports performance that I really can't imagine finding anywhere else. The owner of that Cayenne is a retired hotrodder/ski bum I know, and he basically said it was the perfect vehicle to haul ass up a snowy mountain to a ski area.

[Le Français]

In that case I need a recommendation on the closest Japanese counterpart to the Cayenne, not that I expect there's anything out there to truly equal it. But I could see, as mentioned above, replacing both my Forester and my V6 Accord with one vehicle that could do both things well.

Check out the Infiniti FX45 on the used market. Sporty Japanese SUV, 300+ HP V8, good handling, good reputation for reliability. The FX35 is the V6 version, and more common. For rarer and more expensive, see the 5.0-liter FX50.

For a cheaper option, the Mitsubishi Outlander XLS (3.0 V6) from 2007-2009 handles well for what it is, has paddle shifters, a good AWD system, and very cheap maintenance needs. Some are FWD only.

[Erik]

I've never driven a Cayenne so I can't comment on those. I bought a low-mileage 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT shortly before COVID hit to serve as my new daily with the same goals in mind as articulated for the Cayenne and I have to say, I love driving that thing. The prior owner did just the few minor mods that I would have done myself if I had bought it new. It's got power for days, rides very nicely in everyday mode, handles extremley well in either of the two sport modes and has a very nice interior. At the time, I considered the Cayenne also and felt I got more bang for the buck with the Jeep plus it suits my sense of style better and I wanted to buy American because reasons. Having said that, if the Cayenne is anywhere near as fun to drive (or more so), you can't go wrong from that perspective. I am a huge fan of the actually sporty SUV.

[JRB]

Check out the Infiniti FX45 on the used market. Sporty Japanese SUV, 300+ HP V8, good handling, good reputation for reliability. The FX35 is the V6 version, and more common. For rarer and more expensive, see the 5.0-liter FX50.

For a cheaper option, the Mitsubishi Outlander XLS (3.0 V6) from 2007-2009 handles well for what it is, has paddle shifters, a good AWD system, and very cheap maintenance needs. Some are FWD only.

The FX's are nice but they're simply refined and comfortable. Being truly capable of sportcar-like driving is not part of the equation. It's roughly analogous to the base model Cayenne IMHO, perhaps a nudge comfier.
As to the Mitsubishi, despite being a fan of the 3000GT and Evo, an Outlander is comparable to a Rav4 or Highlander, not a Cayenne - and if that's the game, a 2009-2013ish Rav4 V6 AWD Sport would be the way to go IMHO and much more reliable than the Mitsubishi.

I've never driven a Cayenne so I can't comment on those. I bought a low-mileage 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT shortly before COVID hit to serve as my new daily with the same goals in mind as articulated for the Cayenne and I have to say, I love driving that thing. The prior owner did just the few minor mods that I would have done myself if I had bought it new. It's got power for days, rides very nicely in everyday mode, handles extremley well in either of the two sport modes and has a very nice interior. At the time, I considered the Cayenne also and felt I got more bang for the buck with the Jeep plus it suits my sense of style better and I wanted to buy American because reasons. Having said that, if the Cayenne is anywhere near as fun to drive (or more so), you can't go wrong from that perspective. I am a huge fan of the actually sporty SUV.

The GC SRT8 and GC Trackhawks are very similar to the Cayenne on paper but very, very, different in practice. The GC SRT8 is much more rowdy, fun, irreverent, loud, etc. But while quite comfortable for DD duties and overall a nice truck, the refinement, steering feedback, and overall 'finer touches' of the Cayenne really sets them apart. The street presence is much different as well. Very rarely would the same person compliment both vehicles. The folks that'd give thumbs-up to an SRT8 will only see an overpaid yuppie-mobile in a Cayenne. But the Cayenne is much more likely to impress a woman of refined tastes, or otherwise appeal to the 'happy wife happy life' scenario.

That said, I can see myself owning an GC SRT8 or Trackhawk - I'll probably never buy a Cayenne.

Reliability-wise, neither of them are Toyota pickups but the Jeep's parts are much easier to source here in the US, and it'll be a lot easier to find local mechanics willing to work on one.

[0ddl0t]

Also got a line on an 01 Z06 for $13k from a friend of mine, but as an ex autocross / HPDE car with 150k miles on it, it's probably not something I'll pursue at this time.

As a 2nd/fun car I'd be tempted, especially if it was reasonably well cared for in addition to being tracked...

[Le Français]

The FX's are nice but they're simply refined and comfortable. Being truly capable of sportcar-like driving is not part of the equation. It's roughly analogous to the base model Cayenne IMHO, perhaps a nudge comfier.
As to the Mitsubishi, despite being a fan of the 3000GT and Evo, an Outlander is comparable to a Rav4 or Highlander, not a Cayenne - and if that's the game, a 2009-2013ish Rav4 V6 AWD Sport would be the way to go IMHO and much more reliable than the Mitsubishi.

The context of my response to @Welder was this post, which gave me an idea of the budget.

Yeah, after having life happen, I'm more in the $6800 04 V6 with 110k or $9700 09 S V8 with 145k market...

RAV4s are a good deal more expensive than the Outlanders, which in the configuration I suggested are actually pretty fun to drive for a cheap option.

The FX45 i drove (hard) recently handled and steered a lot better than most heavy crossovers I’ve driven. It’s definitely sporty, though “sportcar-like” is of course a tall order for that class of vehicle.

[Erik]

The GC SRT8 and GC Trackhawks are very similar to the Cayenne on paper but very, very, different in practice. The GC SRT8 is much more rowdy, fun, irreverent, loud, etc. But while quite comfortable for DD duties and overall a nice truck, the refinement, steering feedback, and overall 'finer touches' of the Cayenne really sets them apart. The street presence is much different as well. Very rarely would the same person compliment both vehicles. The folks that'd give thumbs-up to an SRT8 will only see an overpaid yuppie-mobile in a Cayenne. But the Cayenne is much more likely to impress a woman of refined tastes, or otherwise appeal to the 'happy wife happy life' scenario.

I'd be interested in trying the Cayenne sometime to compare. In track mode, the steering input and handling of the SRT are pretty impressive. I have a lot of respect for the Cayenne and the Turbo S gets more than just a thumbs-up out of me, but yeah, I'd have to agree with that assessment.

[BehindBlueI's]

I've never driven a Cayenne so I can't comment on those. I bought a low-mileage 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT shortly before COVID hit to serve as my new daily with the same goals in mind as articulated for the Cayenne and I have to say, I love driving that thing.

At least locally they are significantly more expensive then even the top end Cayenne assuming similar years and miles. I like the GC and had looked at them before.

[Welder]

As a 2nd/fun car I'd be tempted, especially if it was reasonably well cared for in addition to being tracked...

Yeah, it's probably not an awful deal, but in my previous life I had a 40k mile 04 Z06 (well...Z16) and I'm just not really sure if I want to repeat that car again but with higher miles. It was fun, but I think I'm over the C5Z for now. I do keep coming back to it, but not to the point of having to restrain my wallet from jumping out of my pocket on it's own.

Interior-wise, I much prefer the C4. As much as some people might not understand that. But I'm not willing to deal with the rest of the C4 experience to drive that interior anymore. The one I just sold was it for me; no more C4's, not even the ZR-1 which I always lusted after.

Exterior-wise, the C5, even the Z, just never really did it for me. It's the rear end mainly. Now that C6 ZR1 from last weekend....that's a hot-looking car. Maybe I'll just putt around in the ole Accord until I can afford a C6Z or the C7 GS that I really want. The ZR1 in any iteration is beyond what I could justify.