The Semi-Unofficial Pistol-Forum Car geek, gearhead, hot rodder, and vehicle thread

[RevolverRob]

I didn’t think they could make a VW Atlas an uglier than the Audi Q8, but apparently they can.

[Bart Carter]

This is me at Willow Springs International Raceway, turn4.



I am rebuilding this car now. Anyone that would like experience in fabricating and is in the Las Vegas area, let me know.

[Borderland]

This is me at Willow Springs International Raceway, turn4.



I am rebuilding this car now. Anyone that would like experience in fabricating and is in the Las Vegas area, let me know.

Slightly modified AC Bristol.

[0ddl0t]

On 1UZ's: Yes, Toyota heads of that era are not a Gen III LS nor a Honda. With ITB's, Kelford cams, and longtube headers a 1UZ can make 325+whp NA and sound phenomenal with minimal further fuss, but the big benefit is the cheapness of a 1UZ donor, the varying sump configs etc, and how reliable they are. Going for mid-300whp I'd call it a wash between a $1000 donor 1UZ, $1000 worth of Kelford cams, $1000 worth of ITB's, $1000 worth of maintenance bits and cheap chineseium 2UZ Tundra headers, and $1000 worth of standalone ECU/tuning vs $5K for an actually good and complete aluminum block LS swap. Alternatively, a stock 1UZ with the stock ECU and cams with Tundra headers and a manual trans will make ~225whp and 250wtq and cost $1500-2000 complete, minus the manual trans conversion of course. If that kind of HP will do the job, it'll last forever, which makes it great for things like a Miata or AE86 or other light small RWD car that needs a V8 exhaust note.

Once turbochargers are involved, the 1UZ is amazing it's just not regularly explored; the 'big rod' 90-94 1UZ engines can take ~600whp on an unopened block and the sky is the limit with the iron 2UZ-FE block from a Tundra. The only failing is the stock camshaft profile falls off power above 5k no matter how big of of a turbo you have, so cams are a must for big HP.

Toyota, or more accurately Yamaha, knew how to make good performance heads in 1990. They just gave the 1UZ an "F" series head meant for fuel economy and low end torque appropriate for use in luxury comfort sedans & SUVs. If there was a performance "G" head available (as in 4ag 3sg 7mg 2jzg) to make good use of that DOHC I'd find the 1uz swap into non Toyota platforms a lot more appealing.

The UZ was derived from Toyota's CART/IRL race engine so I have to believe Toyota had some decent heads around, they just never came to market...

LS swaps are fantastic but there's a lot of cumulative costs like pushrods, lifters, accessory changes, etc that make a 'cheap' LS turn into a $10k game in a hurry, especially if one is starting with a truck motor. In most cases, I'd recommend finding a ragged out but still running GTO or Fbody for a donor and part out the rest of the chassis after taking what you want.

Around here you can occasionally find a wrecked 98+ WS6 or camaro SS for $1500-3000 and can get beater running salvage titled examples for about twice that. No need for $1,000 manual transmission conversion kits and if some accessory won't fit as is in your engine bay, GM had dozens of permutations out there allowing you to move things around to suit your needs with factory parts.

The LS is virtually the same height (an inch taller) and width ( 1/2 inch narrower) but just 2" longer coming with a weight penalty of ~45 lbs. But those 2 inches & 45 lbs give you an extra ~2 liters of displacement and 50whp stock and the power gap grows rapidly when modding from a $/hp standpoint.

If you were willing to open wallet more and had to have a naturally aspirated Toyota V8, I'd much rather start with the 2ur-gse with its "g" head and extra liter of displacement.

[theJanitor]

This project is getting off the ground. I’ve got the mustang2 suspension here. Tremec and wilwood pieces on this pallet. Ford 9” and 4-link on another. And a 502 sitting in the corner. We’re shoving all of this in my BIL’s ‘71 C10

I just snagged a rust free 84 K5 blazer, that I’m going to turn into a camping rig for my son and me. It’ll probably take me till he’s a teen, at which point he won’t want to hang with dad, anyway :/

The C10 will probably take that long too






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[RevolverRob]

I’ve yet to see a budget LSx build in a track car that didn’t puke its guts out. Sure, everybody’s cousin’s brother-in-law has a 900hp LS6 that’s never had no work done, never, and gets flogged to 8k on every shift. But I’ve never seen that motor in real life not turn to mush almost instantly.

I need two hands to count the number of LSx Camaros and Firebirds I’ve helped push into the pits or off the autocross course. I’m not saying they are unreliable motors, just that you can have your choice of two: lots of power, reliability, and low cost. The LSx as a swap engine makes sense in many settings, but unless you plan on leaving it stock, low cost isn’t the variable to consider. I grant you the LSx is superior in parts availability.

Given that an LSx outweighs a SBF and is physically larger than an SBF, and you can buy a 350 horse 306cid crate SBF with a damn warranty for <$4k there are very few engine swaps that make more sense, if you can wedge a small block in there. I’ve blown up three SBFs over the years. One due to oil pressure loss, that roasted the mains and rods, one from a missed shift, and one high mileage (220k, that lost a rod bearing and then the big end of the rod at pretty much the same time) At 3-350 crank horsepower with a good cooling system and oil, they’ll run to 6-6.5k rpm all day without exploding, for about a billion days on end.

The high mileage one led a very hard life in a half-ton work truck, followed by a twilight era as a drag racer, when I was experimenting with bits and pieces for my Comet. It lived a noble, albeit abused, life.

[JRB]

....For stupid reasons, I want to stuff a 1UZ into the FJ Cruiser (actually, into an FJ40...). It makes zero sense, since the 1GR-FE is an exceptionally reliable hunk of iron (excepting that tendency to burn O2 sensors). A stock 1UZ doesn't make any more horsepower than a 1GR, it doesn't really make an appreciable amount more torque than the 1GR, yet that's my silly American inside. "Bigger is better!" I know, I could supercharge the 1GR and get more power and it's true they finally seemed to have cracked the code on tuning the stock ECMs, in lieu of running a stand-alone or the weaksauce factory TRD tune. But blowers are for little engines or big engines...naturally aspirated V8s belong in trucks - it's as American as apple pie and obesity....

I'm all about dumb ideas like this, but there's a few caveats:

A 1UZ is the same displacement as the 1GR and even the latest model VVTi 1UZ-FE is almost 10 years older than an FJ Cruiser, which is likely to make integration into an FJ's body electronics a problem.

If anything, I'd go for the 3UR-FE 5.7L and trans/transfer case out of a Sequoia of similar vintage, and top it with a Maggie supercharger since it's a bolt-on proposition to that 3UR. Because trucks get along with superchargers quite nicely in my experience

Also, the 'tuning' options for a 1GR and similar vintage Toyotas (such as the Lexus IS-F) are minimal compared to the 'keys to the city' options available to GM, Nissan, etc PCM's. In essence, Toyota PCM 'tuning' vs HP tuners GM etc akin to is black box hex editing vs working with full developer tools when changing software.

We'll know the difference when we see full featured and 100% functional OBD-II compliant twin turbo setups making 750+whp under the hoods of 2UR-GSE powered IS-F's.
If HPTuners ever cracks those PCM's they'll make a killing, and I'll be buying an IS-F.

If you really want that level of tuning/tweaking etc available in an FJ Cruiser, honestly a Gen IV LS swap with a 6L80E would make it a lot easier, because you'd just need to figure out the CAN bus stuff for the factory HVAC and gauges and ensure the VSS signal plays nice with the ABS and thereby the descent control/E-locker ish features.

Toyota, or more accurately Yamaha, knew how to make good performance heads in 1990. They just gave the 1UZ an "F" series head meant for fuel economy and low end torque appropriate for use in luxury comfort sedans & SUVs. If there was a performance "G" head available (as in 4ag 3sg 7mg 2jzg) to make good use of that DOHC I'd find the 1uz swap into non Toyota platforms a lot more appealing.

The UZ was derived from Toyota's CART/IRL race engine so I have to believe Toyota had some decent heads around, they just never came to market...


Around here you can occasionally find a wrecked 98+ WS6 or camaro SS for $1500-3000 and can get beater running salvage titled examples for about twice that. No need for $1,000 manual transmission conversion kits and if some accessory won't fit as is in your engine bay, GM had dozens of permutations out there allowing you to move things around to suit your needs with factory parts.

The LS is virtually the same height (an inch taller) and width ( 1/2 inch narrower) but just 2" longer coming with a weight penalty of ~45 lbs. But those 2 inches & 45 lbs give you an extra ~2 liters of displacement and 50whp stock and the power gap grows rapidly when modding from a $/hp standpoint.

If you were willing to open wallet more and had to have a naturally aspirated Toyota V8, I'd much rather start with the 2ur-gse with its "g" head and extra liter of displacement.

You're singing hymns to the Pope, here. I've had dozens of MK3 Supras, two MK4's, two AE86's, three SW20's, a Supercharged 89 AW11, a few swapped Lexuses (Lexii?) along with a few deviations into other brands like a 3000GT, S13, 95 Miata M, and a couple of Subarus. I've also owned an LS400 and SC400 either of which filled some long term daily driving duties and I put tens of thousands of miles on them when I still owned them. I'm actually an S.mod on the largest Supra forum, though Verticalscope 'improved' things to the point where there's little traffic anymore, but I digress. Bottom line - I wasn't saying there weren't good heads, I'm just saying that the celebrated Toyota engines of that era (20v 4A-GE, Beams 3S-GE, 2JZ-GTE, etc) had good heads but not nearly as good as modern Gen III+ LS or modern Honda heads.

The UZ cylinder heads are an interesting case because if you hold UZ heads alongsize a 2JZ-GTE, 3S-GTE, 16v 4AGE, etc head there's a hell of a lot more in common than there is different. Similarly, if you hold a UZ head up next to a 7A-FE head or 5S-FE head, aside from perhaps the valve angle (I didn't have a way to accurately measure it) There was more in common with the GE heads than anything else. In all honesty, The UZ heads seem to be 'F' series in name only and perhaps valve angle, wheras the port design and combustion chamber design is all very much Yamaha G-series.
The focus on mid-range and low end power in stock form is created by the intake manifold design and stock cam profiles more than anything else. Aussies have figured that out pretty convincingly with various ITB setups and big cams. It doesn't yield the HP to $ that LS's can, especially with the abundance of second hand parts, but it's a lot less limited than one would assume from the 'FE' heads.

The later VVTi 1UZ's were ~300hp and the 3UZ-FE VVTi heads were even better than those, and have done well with turbos. A Tundra 4.7L block with 1UZ or 3UZ-FE VVTi heads is pretty easy to sort out and the combo has some sort of aftermarket support for internals, vs the 2UR-GSE which has little available except expensive bolt-on headers, and virtually no internal parts, camshafts, etc because of the ongoing difficulties in fully cracking the IS-F PCM's.

A Toyota V8 is an expensive project either way, agreed, and I think the best use of a UZ is for a cheap small-ish V8 that can be left basically stock and stuffed into a car like an AE86 or Miata to double the available HP with superb reliability. Once ECU/camshaft changes are involved it's an expensive project. Once 300+hp is involved in a Miata or AE86 you need to get into differential changes, etc so a ~250hp V8 is a great compromise in a lot of ways for a car like that.

Having dealt with a LOT of LS builds over the years, they're expensive too. Around my hometown the days of the $1500-$3000 LS1 donor F-body are long gone, not even the perimeter-bolt '98s. The existing F-bodies out there are stratifying between haggard teenager's cars and pristine garage queens with little in-between.
Buying the neglected and abused cars for cheap means a great deal of maintenance/fresh parts to really make 'drift spec' engines out of them that won't puke something when you're riding the rev limiter.
But buying a running complete car at least permits an accurate assessment of what it needs since you can drive it. Nothing sucks more than spending $4-9k on an LS swap with a Tremec behind it only to find out the synchros are shot and the engine's on its last legs.

[olstyn]

(he's coveted a Z32 300ZX or a SW20 for years)

I am still occasionally cranky that my dad refused to sell me his NA t-top Z32 when he knew he was done enjoying it and then sold it down the road a few months later for several thousand dollars less than I'd have happily given him for it. I've never told him what I'd have offered, but after my mom told me what they sold it for, I informed her that I'd have given them more for it out of frustration. I don't know if she passed that info on to him or not.

[olstyn]

Here are a few pix of my two competition cars.

"Fluffy Unicorn Racing." That's hilariously awesome.

[OlongJohnson]

So of course I had to look on Craigslist yesterday. There's someone in town asking $900 for an E46 330ci that runs but leaks water. Hell, I've dealt with a water-leaking BMW in the middle of nowhere 2 1/2 hours from home before. I suspect it's the kind of deal where if you showed up with five Benjamins and a trailer, you'd leave with a BMW on said trailer.

Jack it up, slide Mustang-like drivetrain under it and go pound laps until you're tired of pounding laps.