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Thread: Would you trust a P320?

  1. #141
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    CDNN has had a bunch of P320s lately, and there's no way I'd trust one of those pistols. A newer current production pistol would be a maybe for me. However, with so many other good striker fired pistols on the market, what's the point in chancing it?

    Sent from my moto e5 cruise using Tapatalk

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by kcevans View Post
    Has Sig corrected the issue with firearms discharging when being dropped?
    Has Sig corrected the magazine concerns?
    Sig has corrected the drop fire issue in new production guns and guns sent back to the factory for the fix. There are probably many old-stock guns at distributors and dealers that haven’t been fixed though. Same with guns already purchased by people who never heard about the fix.

    As far as I know, Sig still recommends that only the “Made in Italy” mags are used for carry/duty and the “Made in USA” mags shouldn’t be.

    A newly produced P320 will probably work just fine but basically everything Sig has done as a company regarding this pistol has left a really bad taste in my mouth. I won’t carry one as long as I’m given the option not to. If the option is taken away from me, then I’ll grudgingly carry one.
    My posts only represent my personal opinion and do not necessarily reflect the opinions or official policies of any employer, past or present. Obvious spelling errors are likely the result of an iPhone keyboard.

  3. #143
    Site Supporter DocGKR's Avatar
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    "Is this a professional assessment or a layman's opinion?"
    The Sig Armorer Course recommendations regarding FCS maintenance and repair are not confidence inspiring in this regard.

    For that matter, neither were the results of the MHS testing nor some real world issues that have cropped up, at least one of which I believe CWM11B is aware of....
    Facts matter...Feelings Can Lie

  4. #144
    Here is my take. Sig, at one point, made fantastic quality P series pistols. The Glock, and other polymer pistols, put Sig at a price disadvantage, and Sig tried to compete by cheapening the P series. That didn’t go well, because the quality of the P series pistols suffered, and these pistols, even cheapened, were still too expensive to comepete with strikers. Sig’s polymer DA/SA pistols were pretty good, but the market wanted strikers. The 250 intro didn’t go well. All of that, caused people through direct experience, or from what they learned through whatever predated the “gun internet” to sour (sorry) on Sig. Sig’s CEO became a controversial figure, who was easy to dislike.

    Sig was trying to survive, and that caused them to innovate. Without the luxury of other successful product lines to allow them to be patient, they pushed a number of “Gen 1” products out the door, like the 320 and MPX, using customers as their beta testers. The products have gotten a lot better, but early adopters got burned. Either through oversight or willful negligence, the 320 had a problem where it would fire when dropped at a certain angle. Sig certainly learned of it before the “collective we,” but it is unclear whether they tried to hide behind “drop safe per industry standards,” or hoped the problem was isolated enough they could slide through it.

    As to the 320 design, my wife and many friends are shooting the crap out of them in daily or nearly daily sessions as USPSA CO pistols. Other than needing a periodic spray cleaning of the FCU, there is no trend of problems with them. The latest Gen MPX is much better. The current 365 and 365 XL pistols are mostly good. The Sig optics are still a work in process, but in fairness so is most every other red dot product. The Cross rifle is very interesting.

    Sig is an easy company to hate, especially by folks that are not using and enjoying their products. Most people using Sig firearms are less vocal than those hating on Sig.
    Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.

  5. #145
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    SIG aside

    SIG aside,
    Reading this thread makes me trust my 1911's, BHP's and Beretta 92's much more!

    YMMV,

    Will

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by GJM View Post
    Here is my take. Sig, at one point, made fantastic quality P series pistols. The Glock, and other polymer pistols, put Sig at a price disadvantage, and Sig tried to compete by cheapening the P series. That didn’t go well, because the quality of the P series pistols suffered, and these pistols, even cheapened, were still too expensive to comepete with strikers. Sig’s polymer DA/SA pistols were pretty good, but the market wanted strikers. The 250 intro didn’t go well. All of that, caused people through direct experience, or from what they learned through whatever predated the “gun internet” to sour (sorry) on Sig. Sig’s CEO became a controversial figure, who was easy to dislike.

    Sig was trying to survive, and that caused them to innovate. Without the luxury of other successful product lines to allow them to be patient, they pushed a number of “Gen 1” products out the door, like the 320 and MPX, using customers as their beta testers. The products have gotten a lot better, but early adopters got burned. Either through oversight or willful negligence, the 320 had a problem where it would fire when dropped at a certain angle. Sig certainly learned of it before the “collective we,” but it is unclear whether they tried to hide behind “drop safe per industry standards,” or hoped the problem was isolated enough they could slide through it.

    As to the 320 design, my wife and many friends are shooting the crap out of them in daily or nearly daily sessions as USPSA CO pistols. Other than needing a periodic spray cleaning of the FCU, there is no trend of problems with them. The latest Gen MPX is much better. The current 365 and 365 XL pistols are mostly good. The Sig optics are still a work in process, but in fairness so is most every other red dot product. The Cross rifle is very interesting.

    Sig is an easy company to hate, especially by folks that are not using and enjoying their products. Most people using Sig firearms are less vocal than those hating on Sig.
    Great post. While not shooting them daily, more like weekly, I am in the camp of those using the products and don't see any problems in my use of them. At the same time, I can certainly admit that Sig is not perfect either.

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by kcevans View Post

    As far as fact base, the PX4 hate that was going on several years ago had no fact but just several posters posting about what they had heard from their brother's friends cousins brother in laws shooting friend.
    The founder of this forum reporting back from training with RCMPs is not "brother's friends cousins brother in laws shooting friend."

    Quote Originally Posted by kcevans View Post
    mostif the haters are just haters becasue of direct knowledge only just what they heard or read on the internet.
    Fools say that they learn by experience. I prefer to profit by others experience. -Otto Von Bismark

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by kcevans View Post
    Has Sig corrected the issue with firearms discharging when being dropped?
    Has Sig corrected the magazine concerns?

    I would like to know because I have been considering purchasing one.

    As far as fact base, the PX4 hate that was going on several years ago had no fact but just several posters posting about what they had heard from their brother's friends cousins brother in laws shooting friend.

    I'm not saying Sig did not have concerns with product quality concerning the P320 line just the fact most if the haters are just haters not becasue of direct knowledge only just what they heard or read on the internet.
    Early PX4s had issues. Period. We had posters here whose LE agencies issued the PX4 and reported from first hand experience and people who conducted training for agencies that issued them.

    Companies make inline changes all the time. The PX4, (or insert model here) you buy today may, or may not be the same as an example from 10 years ago.

    Another factor is the PX4’s rotating barrel lock up requires a unique lubrication procedure for best results.

    Having tried a couple of PX4, including a Langdon model I still hate them despite being a big 92 fan.

    As for the P320, SIG has “fixed” the drop safety issue and the issue with magazines disassembling if dropped loaded or partially loaded. The new mags have a square, rather than round take down hole in the base pad.

    The SIG P320 design, when properly executed, is safe, accurate and reliable.

    Now, SIG continued selling non drop safe guns for more than 6 months after they knew about and had engineered a fix for the drop safe issue. It took a federal lawsuit for them to acknowledge there was a problem.

    They also have both US and Italian made mags but only recommend the Italian mags for Duty use.

    Thus the question is not has the design been corrected ? It has, but rather, do you trust SIG to execute it properly ?

  9. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
    The founder of this forum reporting back from training with RCMPs is not "brother's friends cousins brother in laws shooting friend."



    Fools say that they learn by experience. I prefer to profit by others experience. -Otto Von Bismark
    CBSA (Canadian Border Services Agency) rather than RCMP. Specifically PX4 DAO’s in .40. Todd was not a the only source for the issues CBSA experienced.

    Companies don’t like to advertise inline changes but they are common. Though I have thus far chosen to exercise my option to stick with Glock, the P320s my Agency currently issue are significantly more refined than the first 320 I bought in 2014.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
    The founder of this forum reporting back from training with RCMPs is not "brother's friends cousins brother in laws shooting friend."



    Fools say that they learn by experience. I prefer to profit by others experience. -Otto Von Bismark



    The RCMP has never been issued PX4s (they still carry 5906s). The Canadian customs and border agents were.....
    Last edited by MrInox; 01-02-2020 at 12:19 AM.

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