Draft of upcoming Virginia AWB - Registration

[OlongJohnson]

I don't know enough about the Bundys to decide if their cause was just. My comment dealt only with the fact that I believe the government was shocked when that many people showed up ready to fight.

Total tangent here.

I don't know enough to know if it's a cause/effect, but the correlation certainly exists. Someone else here may know more details. The guy who got his picture taken on the bridge with his AR didn't get arrested until six months or a year later. He probably thought, "Well, if they were going to arrest me for anything, they would have by now." And he started talking. Did a podcast, long enough to be posted in two parts. The first part included his description of using his scope to glass the .gov positions. He was behind bars before the second part aired.

I've always wondered if he would still have been arrested, had he brought a pair of binoculars and used them to do his glassing instead. Was the piece they needed an admission of pointing a loaded firearm at .gov personnel?

Kinda underlines "armed vs. well-armed," i.e., actually knowing what you're doing.

[HCM]

If you believe that a war is being fought, why don't you believe that it is important to know who is fighting and/or leading the fight? Can you think of a single example where it's not important to know your opponent?

Who introduced H.B. 4021? Who funds the Democracy PAC? Who funds the Everytown for Gun Safety PAC?

If you consider a culture war to be like a battle, your fellow citizens who want 'common sense gun control' might be like ground troops. These people don't fight unless they are being led, however.

Politics are the battles, I am talking about the war.

For the battles, you can follow the money to see who the opponents are. At least in the U.S. political system. That is the exact opposite of the secret “deep state” cabal such deep state conspiracy theories imply. Conspiracy theories are the province of weak minds.

At the strategic level you have it backwards. It’s not top down, it’s bottom up.

The politicians and those funding them want power. They are not “leaders.” They play on, and try to make use of an anti gun sentiment that exists in a segment of the population.

Beating HB 4021 or boycotting the founders of so called “gun safety” PACs are just battles. As we saw in Vietnam and other places, you can win all the battles until the last one and still lose the war.

To win the war you have to change people’s minds at the ground level. “Hearts and minds” is hard and takes years, if not decades.

One part of that is recognizing some people not only don’t think like you, but that some don't think at all. Rather, they act primarily out of emotion. You can cite all the facts you want but until you figure out how to have guns make them “feel” safe instead of unsafe you will simply be delaying the inevitable.

A perfect example of this is the outpouring of grassroots activism you are seeing against gun control efforts in VA. Regardless of the legal validity of 2A sanctuary declarations they are very effective acts of political and ideological influence. I don’t recall seeing any thing of similar scale in places like NY, CT, CA etc.

[Totem Polar]

The fight in Virginia should be a NATIONAL line in the sand. If I could give one message to people living in other States who value the 2A it would be to make VA the place for your last stand. Don’t wait till it comes to you. The other side already acts nationally to win at the state level.

Donate to VCDL, to political candidates, spread the word, even participate in events if you can. What happened in CO had a national affect politically of slowing down the gun control drive IMO.

All is not lost in VA. We can push back. We can make the political cost very high...

This is a very good point. Perhaps everyone that is unhappy with Wayne's NRA should give this year’s contribution to VCDL instead. WA state got pummeled with out-of-state Bloomberg dough; what’s good for the goose, and all that.

Shutting this down in VA in a public and brutal way can only be good for 2A efforts in other states.

"First they came for NY, and I didn’t speak out because: F NY.

Then they came for CO, and I didn’t speak out because: F CO.

Then they came for WA, and I didn’t speak out because: F WA.

Then they came for VA, and I didn’t speak out because: F VA.

When they came for my state, there was nobody left to speak out because: F me."

[HCM]

This is a very good point. Perhaps everyone that is unhappy with Wayne's NRA should give this year’s contribution to VCDL instead. WA state got pummeled with out-of-state Bloomberg dough; what’s good for the goose, and all that.

Shutting this down in VA in a public and brutal way can only be good for 2A efforts in other states.

"First they came for NY, and I didn’t speak out because: F NY.

Then they came for CO, and I didn’t speak out because: F CO.

Then they came for WA, and I didn’t speak out because: F WA.

Then they came for VA, and I didn’t speak out because: F VA.

When they came for my state, there was nobody left to speak out because: F me."

This is a great idea.

[JDD]

I''ll let him know.

Is that who I think it is...?

[TGS]

Is that who I think it is...?

ole' 40mm himself, yep!

I have to admit, when I heard it was him I thought it was going to be way more...…"rash". He did a great job, though.

[JDD]

Politics are the battles, I am talking about the war.

For the battles, you can follow the money to see who the opponents are. At least in the U.S. political system. That is the exact opposite of the secret “deep state” cabal such deep state conspiracy theories imply. Conspiracy theories are the province of weak minds.

At the strategic level you have it backwards. It’s not top down, it’s bottom up.

The politicians and those funding them want power. They are not “leaders.” They play on, and try to make use of an anti gun sentiment that exists in a segment of the population.

Beating HB 4021 or boycotting the founders of so called “gun safety” PACs are just battles. As we saw in Vietnam and other places, you can win all the battles until the last one and still lose the war.

To win the war you have to change people’s minds at the ground level. “Hearts and minds” is hard and takes years, if not decades.

One part of that is recognizing some people not only don’t think like you, but that some don't think at all. Rather, they act primarily out of emotion. You can cite all the facts you want but until you figure out how to have guns make them “feel” safe instead of unsafe you will simply be delaying the inevitable.

A perfect example of this is the outpouring of grassroots activism you are seeing against gun control efforts in VA. Regardless of the legal validity of 2A sanctuary declarations they are very effective acts of political and ideological influence. I don’t recall seeing any thing of similar scale in places like NY, CT, CA etc.

This.

I am good friends with folks on the whole spectrum of the 2A issue. People who run the gamut from literal (former) NRA lobbyists to someone who is a key community organizer for Moms Demand Action. I may also know a few Feds of varying political views. This is not a "deep state" thing, this is not a "UN 2030" thing (if you have ever had to work with the business end of the UN, you will understand why they are scary for entirely different reasons), it is a reflection of who was more effective at marketing their message at a grassroots level.

Unfortunately for 2A folks, gun control has become an easy touchstone for the ever increasing population that is discontent and frequently scared of prominent conservative politics. Rather than being able to effectively highlight how firearms even the playing field and ensure safety and security for minorities and women, gun control folks have been able to frame the issue as another tool or aspect of the same issues that have galvanized them to political action.

[GardoneVT]

The problem is simple. Politics is basically a sales job, and the anti gun camp has better marketers.

Consider for a moment an agnostic voter who knows only what they’ve seen on TV about guns.
They’re presented with two sales pitches.

Gun banner: “Vote for gun control. Guns are deadly weapons , and we regulate so many other less deadly things. This just makes sense”

Pro-Gun : “Fuck commies and liberals in the taint. Guns are a gawd- given right . You vote for gun control , you’re voting this country down the drain. Besides it’s in the constitution! “


Can anyone guess which sales pitch is less offensive and more acceptable to the unaware majority?

[mtnbkr]

The problem is simple. Politics is basically a sales job, and the anti gun camp has better marketers.

Consider for a moment an agnostic voter who knows only what they’ve seen on TV about guns.
They’re presented with two sales pitches.

Gun banner: “Vote for gun control. Guns are deadly weapons , and we regulate so many other less deadly things. This just makes sense”

Pro-Gun : “Fuck commies and liberals in the taint. Guns are a gawd- given right . You vote for gun control , you’re voting this country down the drain. Besides it’s in the constitution! “


Can anyone guess which sales pitch is less offensive and more acceptable to the unaware majority?

Yup. I talk up the fun aspects of shooting, compare it to golf or darts (ie hand eye coordination and hitting tiny targets at distance). I might also talk to folks about history, engineering, collecting, etc. Only if they're on board with those elements or particularly concerned about personal protection do I mention that as a reason to own a gun. The whole "muh rights" thing doesn't come up.

Chris

[noguns]

Possible grandfsthering.

But you would have to register....

https://www.virginiamercury.com/2019...existing-guns/