Grip Strength, Gender, and Shooting Performance

[BigD]

Here's Mike Seeklander's description of the quarter-panel grip. What I am again confused about is that he advocates locking the elbows. Many top shooters, Julie Golub included, advocate not locking the elbows.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xl1u...ature=youtu.be


Also, some top shooters, as far as I know, do not use a death grip.

Randy

As others have said, there’s not complete consensus on how to shoot among top shooters. No doubt Seeklander has tried to shoot without elbows locked and found it didn’t work as well for him.

(Having said that, I think more top shooter than not use the slightly bent elbow technique. So when in doubt, try what most do first. Experiment as needed.)

[voodoo_man]

What do you mean by 45 degree angle? Thanks,

Randy

forward thumb of non-shooting hand pushes against the frame of the pistol

[runcible]

There are a lot of people who don't really know why what they do works, and some of these people are very accomplished shooters. After spending serious time down Hwansik Kim's rabbit hole, I think there is:

1) Confusion between gripping hard and locking the wrist. It is not obvious that these can be done independently unless you work on it.

2) Confusion between gripping the gun hard and returning the gun after recoil. These are not the same thing, and aren't directly related unless the gun is slipping inside the grip, or the grip is coming apart.

3) Confusion between how everyone needs to grip guns, and how a particular gun fits one person's hand.

Minus the Kim nexus, this very much matches my own experience and opinions on the matter; and the absence of both mindfulness in one's own process and the ability to articulate such, is a huge motivator on my part in approaching the skillset.

[Gio]

I still find grip strength to be very valuable, although I've backed off a little on how hard I squeeze the gun in the past year and try to focus more on locking my wrists like Hwansik has discussed. I still close a 2.5 CoC gripper though, so my ~70% of maximum grip on my support hand is still a significant amount. I also find grip strength is more important shooting a lightweight polymer gun than a 45 oz steel frame production gun.

I don't think you can look at a USPSA national championship match (or any USPSA match) and draw a conclusion about grip strength based on the overall results. There are so many factors that go into final standings and performance at a major match like that. Justine and Ashley shoot completely different match strategies. Justine really seems to swing for the fences on every stages, and as a result, she dropped a lot more points and penalties than Ashley. She connected enough to slightly edge her out in this match though. Ashley shoots very consistent and conservatively, and as a result her final performances are going to be much more consistent over the course of multiple matches.

I shot an extremely conservative match at this nationals and felt like I left a lot of time on the table being overly cautious on my sights and movement. It was good enough for a top 12 finish though, and other shooters who are often faster/more aggressive than me in matches got caught up with too many penalties. I wouldn't say that I could have finished higher or lower because of my grip strength though. I could have been more aggressive on partials, entries, and exits and possibly shaved 1-2 seconds per stage, but that could have also potentially cost me 4-5 extra penalties and a lot fewer A's in the process. This is more of a match execution strategy than a technical shooting discussion related to grip.

[Clobbersaurus]

I still find grip strength to be very valuable, although I've backed off a little on how hard I squeeze the gun in the past year and try to focus more on locking my wrists like Hwansik has discussed. I still close a 2.5 CoC gripper though, so my ~70% of maximum grip on my support hand is still a significant amount. I also find grip strength is more important shooting a lightweight polymer gun than a 45 oz steel frame production gun.

I don't think you can look at a USPSA national championship match (or any USPSA match) and draw a conclusion about grip strength based on the overall results. There are so many factors that go into final standings and performance at a major match like that. Justine and Ashley shoot completely different in match strategies. Justine really seems to swings for the fences on every stages, and as a result, she dropped a lot more points and penalties than Ashley. She connected enough to slightly edge her out in this match though. Ashley shoots very consistent and conservatively, and as a result her final performances are going to be much more consistent over the course of multiple matches.

I shot an extremely conservative match at this nationals and felt like I left a lot of time on the table being overly cautious on my sights and movement. It was good enough for a top 12 finish though, and other shooters who are often faster/more aggressive than me in matches got caught up with too many penalties. I wouldn't say that I could have finished higher or lower because of my grip strength though. I could have been more aggressive on partials, entries, and exits and possibly shaved 1-2 seconds per stage, but that could have also potentially cost me 4-5 extra penalties and a lot fewer A's in the process. This is more of a match execution strategy than a technical shooting discussion related to grip.

Top 12 is no joke. Well done!

One of the best instructors I ever trained with always said that he taught “A way. Not the way.” Meaning he taught what works for many shooters but students had to realize that it may not work best for them. GJM has it right in the post above.

[Obelisk]

I think I can offer something here. Last year I fell and hurt a nerve in my right hand. Before the injury I could rep a CoC #2 15-20 reps. After injury my strength on my right hand on my dynameter was 40#s. What was injured wasn’t affecting my flexors, it was keeping my wrist straight, because as I squeezed my wrist would tilt down. If I steadied the gripper I gripped like normal. I couldn’t even use a staple gun. My shooting got terrible, but then again I had a nerve issue so that plays several ways.

I’m healed from it now. Shoot better than before. One thing I learned on hand strength it’s not just about the grippers. I own close to a grand in gripping gear. The same muscles that made me weak can also make your grip stronger. Holding onto a sledge hammer with your arm by your side with the head forward and tilting your wrist up to raise the head of the sledge does wonders for grip strength and real world strength.

One great hand gripping tool that’s over looked is the Harbinger grip system. They look like 3 cheap silicon rings you grip. Something grandma would use. I bought then for something easier to use when I had my injury. Let me just say they are awesome. You can use one finger or two or the whole grip. You can grip and manipulate the wrist up and down and back and forth. Pinch them with your finger tips. Yes they get easier and weaken a bit with use, but still fantastic for $23. There’s three weights. Orange is easy, red is moderate, black until broken in will make you angry as it is hard to close.

I have all the CoC grippers, but if I had to buy again I’d buy the Vatiz adjustable gripper. Same grip angle and same sized handles. That gripper is a beast! I love that gripper. I don’t even touch my CoC anymore.

Back to the wrist stabilization of my injury. Let me explain how important those sledge hammer exercises are. If I take a hollow metal broom handle and slide one end of the CoC #3 in there I can rep it a lot. That’s because I’m not limited to stabilizing my grip and I can go ham on my flexors. So as a part of grip training those sledge hammer or a metal rod exercises are very important. Hammer curls while you workout help as well.