Gun culture and foreign students

[Kanye Wyoming]

They tend to have English as their second language. Where would they prefer to go instead?

• Canada – that’s where I went for college, great place, the best universities there are the equal of ours or close to it, really f***ing cold, much smaller playing field if they intend to try to stay unless like my wife they marry an American for a green card.
• England – fine if you prefer knife wounds. Really f***ing rainy, much smaller playing field if they intend to try to stay assuming some sort of Brexit, and even without Brexit they must be able to obtain UK permanent residence and maintain it for several years, or UK citizenship, in order to widen the playing field to all of the EU. My guess is only the top places in the UK have any international cache.
• Australia – really f***ing far away from everywhere else, much smaller playing field if they intend to try to stay. Do any of the institutions there have any international cache?
• New Zealand – Ditto but lots of eligible young sheep if that’s what you’re into.
• India (where most higher ed is in English) – for non-Indians, not bloody likely.
• South Africa – not if you’re driven by a fear of being shot.
• Ireland – good institutions, one or two with international cache, nice place, really f***ing rainy, much smaller playing field unless they can get Irish permanent residence and maintain it for several years, or Irish citizenship, then the playing field widens to all of the EU.

Maybe I’m missing some.

There’s France, Germany, Sweden, Denmark, Switzerland, Israel, and a few others, but then they have to know French or German or etc.

I’d add that, unless they’re looking at Johns Hopkins, University of Chicago, or a few other places in similar environments, if being shot on campus or in the surrounding neighborhood is what they’re afraid of, they likely lack basic computational or critical thinking skills, and we already have a sufficient quantity of such kids in our institutions of higher education.

If I were a consular officer I would ask student visa applicants “when you go to the gun range nearest campus what’s the first firearm you want to shoot?” Whatever the brand/type/caliber named, they’re in. If they recoiled in horror, good luck to them in Australia. This may explain in part why I'd never make it as a consular officer.

[LorenzoS]

"What can we do to make foreign students who disapprove of American's right to self defense feel more comfortable" is a question I've asked myself exactly zero times.

[Chance]

I can only speak about from my very narrow experience, but at least with regard to my field: if a student is dissuaded from coming here due to some perceived safety issue, there are *thousands* (literally) who would happily take their place. I don't suspect we'll be running low on a pool of potential international grad students for many years.

Concepts of cheating, honesty, academic integrity, and intellectual property tend to be more poorly understood and practiced by foreign students than by Americans.

While I don't want to paint with too broad a brush, I have seen this to be true, and deal with it frequently. I had two grad students (out of 47 this semester) I caught cheating just this week. International students can be taught that ethical guidelines are important to observe, albeit by making an example of the students who don't learn that lesson.

While undergraduate degrees are enthusiastically sought by Americans, the academy has done a poor job in marketing graduate education to citizens.

Also true. I don't believe I've had an American grad student this year, and I've had about... 140 grad students this year.

[Duke]

"What can we do to make foreign students who disapprove of American's right to self defense feel more comfortable" is a question I've asked myself exactly zero times.

Yea.

[BillSWPA]

Many of these foreign students come from places where they read and hear nothing except what the government tells them. With exposure to nothing else, that is what they believe is true. Is this what we are supposed to try to accommodate?


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[Joe in PNG]

I'm an American, for Offler's sake. Why should I give any amount of excrement about what some damn foreigner thinks about how we do things?

Hell, most of them are stupid enough to think that Marxism is still a valid economic theory, not a ridiculous 19th century pseudo-religious economic cargo cult.
Then there's their habit of forcing unpopular parts of their population into concentration camps and gulags.

Bugger them, and likewise to the oikophobic wannabe-Europeans that pander to them.

[P30]

Even the kids from the PRC were nice kids and hard working.

This matches my experience.

I had a Chinese co-worker for some years here in Germany, where he had just finished his studies (geomatics). He never criticized US gun laws. But he questioned US democracy. I remember when everybody was happy that Obama became president. When I asked my co-worker, he said, it's a joke that Obama got the Nobel price at the beginning of his presidency before he did anything. I agreed. And he said, US policy will not change. I did not know. Later I was disappointed by Obama.

Of course I don't say Chinese democracy is better. Nor did he. It is not. But he willingly went back to China from Germany. When he went back, he told me, he will miss driving with a car to nice places like Schloss Neuschwanstein. He made a career in China and got a nice daughter with his wife. I hope and suppose, he's happy there.

Bottom line: I knew a Chinese good guy. But I think, the Chinese political system is very questionable. You always have to distinguish between people and the system, they live in.

[HCM]

[QUOTE=Glenn E. Meyer;955036]Seems US gun culture deters some foreign students. For academics, this is a problem as:

1. It gives antigun academics another reason to rant about guns
2. Pragmatically, many schools try to get foreign students who will pay full tuition to help their bottom line:

Here's a quote

https://www.chronicle.com/interactiv...115-GunCulture

The actual article is behind a pay wall.

Some analysis suggests that the gun culture is more of a deterrent to enrollment than the 'Trump' effect. However, students from countries with mandatory miliitary service or some gun culture weren't affected. Some were attracted as in one school half the rifle and pistol club was from overseas students.

Just for your info, folks. No editorial agenda on my part. If they don't want to come here, that's their choice. Tough.

PS - in the Remington thread, I decided continuing to fire back and forth in that one wasn't productive, so I let it go. No need for another debate on presidential qualities. Views are well known.[/QUOT

Those anti gun academics are free to leave for some gun phobic paradise like the UK or Venezuela. Same for the students. The schools need to stop wasting money in amenities like they were running cruise ships. Then they won’t need the dirty foreign money.

[OlongJohnson]

Of course I don't say Chinese democracy is better.

That album is never gonna drop anyway.

[peterb]

No experience with students, but I’ve taken my Chinese colleagues to the range when they’ve been here for training. They were most impressed by how much harder shooting is than it looks in the movies. ;-)

We usually don’t talk much about politics. They aren’t impressed with their leaders either, so we just trade a few examples of stupid government policies, roll our eyes and move to another topic.