LE uniforms dressing down ?

[Le Français]

Somewhat off-topic PSA: For those who don’t like being subjected to nonsensical uniform policies and who would rather wear comfortable plain clothes in the style of their choice, I strongly recommend typing “1811” into the USAJobs search bar, and/or calling an alphabet soup recruiter.

[voodoo_man]

Somewhat off-topic PSA: For those who don’t like being subjected to nonsensical uniform policies and who would rather wear comfortable plain clothes in the style of their choice, I strongly recommend typing “1811” into the USAJobs search bar, and/or calling an alphabet soup recruiter.

1811's may not worry about uniforms but patrol life is the best life. Even though we bitch and moan, patrol is the greatest show on Earth and has the most action available anywhere on a daily basis.

[peterb]

As a private citizen, I don’t care exactly what the uniform is, but I think it should be obvious — from a reasonable distance — that it is a police uniform. If I have to read an embroidered chest logo on a polo shirt to figure that out, it’s not working for me.

Given that so many folks have been conditioned to respond to the “traditional” uniform, I’d think that an updated version of that with modern materials and ergonomic features might be a reasonable compromise.

If folks want to be more casual, the casual uniform should be consistent and distinctive enough that it is easily recognized in the community as the police uniform.

[TGS]

I get it's a sliding scale and reasonable minds can differ on where to draw the line. I just draw it well short of polo/khaki for street officers and people investigating things that matter.

This is another thing I differ on, likely due to our region.

I've worked in both NYC and DC. In both locales, everybody wears a suit.

You don't stand out by wearing a suit in these areas. It doesn't make you look powerful, it makes you look like another number on the roster, nobody special....especially given that most cops don't look good in suits. Like 95% of people who wear suits, cops wear a suit because they're told they have to wear a suit, and they don't look impressive.

The guy that does his job in jeans is more powerful. Who the fuck is he that he gets to wear jeans for his job, or at least dress down? Not a cog in the machine, that's who.

It's also possible that I'm just irresponsible and will see things differently when I've been on as long as you. I definitely don't abide by the "suits all the time" idea, but most of our senior management don't abide by it, either. Suits are for a time and place, not 24/7. It's also possible that simply being a federal agent carried a weight to the public that doesn't occur when interacting with local investigators, and that has acted as a "crutch" to my outlook and altered my view. My partner nearly busted out laughing one time when I arrested a person in court after being ROR'd, and when the defender got all pissy that federal agents were arresting their client all the witnesses started going, "Ohhhh daaaaaammmnmnnnnn the feds got her! THE FEDS!"

IDK. Me personally, even before I got into LE, I would have felt way more weight if I were to be interviewed by a guy with a beard and rolled up sleeves showing tatoos as opposed to a clean shaven suit who's obviously somebody's bitch.

[BehindBlueI's]

It's also possible that simply being a federal agent carried a weight to the public that doesn't occur when interacting with local investigators, and that has acted as a "crutch" to my outlook and altered my view.

It does. Guys who won't say shit to uniformed cops talk to detectives. Guys who won't say shit to detectives talk to feds. I've seen it with joint robbery investigations with the FBI and ATF. At least partially stemming from the perception "damn, now it's serious". Shitbirds know they have to do more real time on federal charges and that there's more resources available once the feds are involved in something. Hollywood helps, too, both detectives and feds. Uniformed cops are often portrayed as idiots or clowns. Detectives and feds are portrayed as cunning and intelligent. Even if they are bad guys, they are smart bad guys.

On the other hand I always get plenty of overtime when protective details come to town for a uniformed presence. I've had people walk right past the people really in charge to ask me a question for me to reply I'm window dressing, go talk to that guy.

Different tools, different contexts.

[Le Français]

patrol is the greatest show on Earth and has the most action available anywhere on a daily basis.

There definitely is some “je ne sais quoi” about being a first responder, no doubt. Hell of a ride.

[Cypher]

I have worked for three security companies and at some point during my training all three of them have referenced the same study.

According to my training a bunch of criminals who attacked police officers were interviewed and asked why they thought they could get away with attacking that particular officer.

The predominant answer was that if the cop looked sloppy he was deemed incompetent and presumed to be an easy target.

My uniforms are all cheap and they look cheap. Every time I've had to interact with a CSPD cop I look at their uniforms compared to mine and you can tell it's a quality uniform. The material is heavier. The uniform doesn't look threadbare. I've never seen a CSPD cop who's uniform looked like it needed to be ironed. I don't see buttons coming off, I don't see tears in the pockets, the uniforms fit ( as I type this I am wearing a 4X National Patrol shirt that literally hangs to my knees because that's all they had when they outfitted me with uniforms for this company). In short I've never seen a CSPD cop that looked like a rag bag.

What I find confusing as a citizen is when the police department uses a half a dozen different uniforms. Because then I don't know if the person I'm talking to is a cop or not. Is this an authorized CSPD uniform or is it a security guard in a reasonable facsimile? Because I've seen that happen too.

I said all that to say that in my uneducated opinion the police should have one uniform maybe two and it should be distinctive. In Colorado Springs the police department wears navy blue cargo pants and a blue gray shirt and there's a city ordinance that no security company in town can wear uniforms in that color scheme (although a bunch of them try to get as close as they can).

[TGS]

What I find confusing as a citizen is when the police department uses a half a dozen different uniforms. Because then I don't know if the person I'm talking to is a cop or not. Is this an authorized CSPD uniform or is it a security guard in a reasonable facsimile? Because I've seen that happen too.

Interesting......where I grew up, every small municipality had its own PD with its own uniform. You generally had some trends, where most of the state followed something akin to the State Troopers and NYC metro area dressed akin to NYPD, but there were still some wild cards thrown in there as well as everyone having something different about their uniforms regardless. The municipalities in NJ tend to be very small compared to the newer parts of the country, some as small as 9 sq miles. The Northeast is very different compared to the rest of the US, so it's kind of hard to describe how all of these "small" towns are small, but in a densely populated area that in the rest of the country would be viewed as being one big town/city. Imagine a city in most of the US, but instead of having neighborhoods within a city, all those major neighborhoods are their own city/town. As an example of the size difference, some of the counties out west would span half the state of NJ, and the towns/cities can be about as large as the counties in NJ.

So, lots and lots of various uniforms on virtually any trip when you leave the house....even the State Troopers had a couple different variations based on their assignment. Never was concerned about it. Even as a teenager it was very easy to tell the difference between police and security guards....general fit/finish of the uniform, confidence and the way they carried themselves.

New York has an interesting solution to this identity issue, whereby security guards are mandated square badges. Only police (or deputized federal guards operating outside state regulations) can have regular looking badges.

[Cypher]

Interesting......where I grew up, every small municipality had its own PD with its own uniform. You generally had some trends, where most of the state followed something akin to the State Troopers and NYC metro area dressed akin to NYPD, but there were still some wild cards thrown in there as well as everyone having something different about their uniforms regardless. The municipalities in NJ tend to be very small compared to the newer parts of the country, some as small as 9 sq miles. The Northeast is very different compared to the rest of the US, so it's kind of hard to describe how all of these "small" towns are small, but in a densely populated area that in the rest of the country would be viewed as being one big town/city. Imagine a city in most of the US, but instead of having neighborhoods within a city, all those major neighborhoods are their own city/town. As an example of the size difference, some of the counties out west would span half the state of NJ, and the towns/cities can be about as large as the counties in NJ.

So, lots and lots of various uniforms on virtually any trip when you leave the house....even the State Troopers had a couple different variations based on their assignment. Never was concerned about it. Even as a teenager it was very easy to tell the difference between police and security guards....general fit/finish of the uniform, confidence and the way they carried themselves.

What I meant was different uniforms within the department. What you see most with CSPD is the traditional uniform shown in the picture but when I was looking through their Facebook page I counted at least six different uniforms.

New York has an interesting solution to this identity issue, whereby security guards are mandated square badges. Only police (or deputized federal guards operating outside state regulations) can have regular looking badges.

IMO security guard shouldn't have badges on their uniforms period. I'm not a cop. I have no authority that any other citizen doesn't have. There's no reason for me to have that stupid badge on my shirt to make people think that I do.

I remember taking my wife to Baskin-Robbins one day and I was standing in line and I noticed some idiot standing in line with us. Now this is 25 years ago so my memory is a little hazy but I'm fairly certain he was open carrying but he had this stupid badge on his belt that said "Licensed Security Officer". I seem to remember him wearing that badge right in front of his gun. The gun I'm not sure about the badge there is no doubt in my mind he had it on his belt because I remember commenting on it to my wife and laughing at the guy. There is no way in the world, you could not convince me if your life depended on it that that idiot didn't want people to think he was a cop.

In Colorado Springs the word police can not appear in any form on a security uniform. So like those arm patches it's a Special Police and all that are a no go here and if it was up to me I ditched the badge and there be a patch on uniform that said Allied Universal Private Pecurity instead.

Having said that though, in Colorado Springs the words "Private Security" have to be somewhere on your uniform and they have to be very distinctive.

[voodoo_man]

Just for clarifications sake, I don't particularly care what the uniform looks like, as long it adhered to basic principles of logic. It's almost 2020, as long as the uniform uses modern fabrics, gussets and is build around comfort and durability, the colors don't particularly matter. A uniform should be uniform, meaning everyone in the PD has to wear the same one of a few types so there is never more than two or three types worn at one time depending on location. Every state has a tradition and that's all well and good, but sticking to tradition in disregard of logic is pointless.

Officers and top brass should be required to wear the same exact uniform at all times. If the street officer has to wear a vest and rig everyday then the chief has to wear the same thing, there should never be any hypocrisy in this, LAPD is a great example.

Some roles require more of a tactical approach, that doesn't mean they should be all swatted out everyday but there are plenty of place in the US where that's absolutely required, that should be part of work in that type of area, not due to the type of unit or whatever you work at.

The mission dictates the uniform nothing else. The moment outside considerations start to play a role then there will be consequences and morale is usually the first one to go. Uncomfortable officers are unhappy and unproductive, prove me wrong.