Mexican cartel massacre: 9 Americans, including 6 children murdered

[fixer]

Nasty, grease-ball, Saudi Arabia level shit going down in Mexico.

Nothing new.

Don't see why we send in Marines or anything else to fix a giant pile of crap just because some dirty-ass Mormons got caught off guard.

[OlongJohnson]

Lots of interesting background. Evidently you can drink liquor and swear and be a "Mormon?" I am confused about what FLDS/LDS practices these guys are keeping, if any. I can't imagine they are "in communion" with the mainstream LDS church.

Best part of the video is the bit where the "community activist" totally admits they bring in guns into the colonies and says they have told the Federales to come get 'em if you want 'em. I don't blame them a bit.

The thing that struck me is that was absolutely a Potemkin village tour. The visitors basically talked with one elder. No multiple interviews means no mismatched stories. They were shown what the elders wanted them to see. Those towns were shut down. Nobody coming or going, doing work, doing business. Kids playing games on a grassy field. No adults getting any work done anywhere. Everything sanitized before they got there.

[Borderland]

The thing that struck me is that was absolutely a Potemkin village tour. The visitors basically talked with one elder. No multiple interviews means no mismatched stories. They were shown what the elders wanted them to see. Those towns were shut down. Nobody coming or going, doing work, doing business. Kids playing games on a grassy field. No adults getting any work done anywhere. Everything sanitized before they got there.

Yeah, quite a production, wasn't it. Even the Federales wanted to have a part in it.

Some of the Federales that I saw down there carrying M4's weren't wearing uniforms. They did ride around in the back of pick ups tho.

Mexican patrol vehicle (MPV).

[Robinson]

And my uncle was a pilot at Pearl Harbor when it was attacked. He was happy that the bombs were dropped as that meant he wouldn't have to fly over the invasion of Japan. He was scheduled be one of the glider pilots that were going to be towed in.

At dinner, years later, he said that he thought we should have waited for the second bomb. Thus, your false equivalency is BS. Burning children alive for your benefit, drug cartel, winning a war - is morally suspect. It can only be excused and/or justified for a goal. You can determine that your goal is justified. Others might not.

So your false equivalency is just posturing BS, as I said earlier. We do horrors for our benefit, true believers think they are always moral. Deeper thinkers understand that we do horrors and they are not noble. But we have our motives.

So the 8 year old was to blame as she didn't read a flyer. Great intellectual argument. The Mormons chose to live in a dangerous area for their own benefit.

It is most certainly a false equivalency. Tell us what you think the motivation for bombing the shit out of Japanese cities was. Making money? Controlling trade? Just for fun? How many Japanese civilians would have been killed had we been forced to invade? What the hell?! They started that shit, we fought a long, difficult, bloody war in the Pacific to get to where we could bring the fight to the mainland, then we told them to surrender or else. They flipped us the bird. The Japanese government was responsible for the deaths of the people in those cities, not to mention the Americans (and others) who died in the fighting. They were responsible for ALL of it.

[Borderland]

It is most certainly a false equivalency. Tell us what you think the motivation for bombing the shit out of Japanese cities was. Making money? Controlling trade? Just for fun? How many Japanese civilians would have been killed had we been forced to invade? What the hell?! They started that shit, we fought a long, difficult, bloody war in the Pacific to get to where we could bring the fight to the mainland, then we told them to surrender or else. They flipped us the bird. The Japanese government was responsible for the deaths of the people in those cities, not to mention the Americans (and others) who died in the fighting. They were responsible for ALL of it.

And lets not forget that, especially today, Veterans day.

[Lex Luthier]

Total thread drift: my grandma's best friend (besides my dad, her son-in-law) was a Japanese woman named Kiyoko Kobayashi that Nana met in grad school at San Francisco State University in 1961.
Kiyoko was an adult survivor of Hiroshima- she would have been 23-24 years old then, and was married.
Kiyoko was *adamant* that dropping The Bomb both times was the right thing to do, given the circumstances. Having spoken to her directly about it as a young adult in the mid 1990s, I believe her.