AR Rifle 20"

[JRB]

I don't wanna turn this place into arfcom, but I found sumdood's photo of his A2 he took in the woods and photochopped the buttstock, grip, handguard and mag onto it. Wanted to see if it looked as right as I thought it would, and it was a lot cheaper than buying all the parts. I like it. My eyes, YMMV. Kinda like a resto-mod muscle car. Old, familiar shape with some modern style and tech nicely integrated. I've never really liked the look of the traditional A1/A2 furniture. The quad rail is almost retro in 2019, but it's also the newest from BCM. There's another thread around here where someone is saying they think the QRF might be the best option due to size, stiffness, ventilation, etc.

Just like those restomod muscle cars, each one is a take on what the owner/builder likes and liking different things is part of what makes that whole scene so much fun! The QRF rail is definitely stiff and it would resist heat buildup much better than most modern M-lok etc sorts of rails, so if you're going to run through a half case in an afternoon that'd be a lot more pleasant to work with for sure.
You're right, though, in that a quad rail is basically retro at this point. Crazy how fast this stuff is changing!

Not long after I made that post, I was killing time on BCM's website and found out they offer a 14.5in middy with an A4/M4 style FSB and a few different free floated rails, so now it's likely I'll be buying a matching pair - one for me, and one for my prior-service wife who thinks any AR that doesn't have a traditional FSB 'doesn't look right'. Those plus pin & weld jobs with the appropriate suppressor mounts for a decent can.. heck yeah!

[Bigghoss]

Not long after I made that post, I was killing time on BCM's website and found out they offer a 14.5in middy with an A4/M4 style FSB and a few different free floated rails, so now it's likely I'll be buying a matching pair - one for me, and one for my prior-service wife who thinks any AR that doesn't have a traditional FSB 'doesn't look right'. Those plus pin & weld jobs with the appropriate suppressor mounts for a decent can.. heck yeah!

I just got one of them not long ago and I really like it. Put it on an A1 fixed stock lower and now it's my favorite rifle.

[deputyG23]

If you want an A2 style fixed carry handle, and you don't mind the ban-era Colt weirdness, you can frequently find a 20in HBAR or similar configuration for $600-700 on Gunbroker. That's a lot of quality for the price, but again, ban-era Colt weirdness bugs some people. If you don't want to change shit on the wepaon and just want to run mags through it and keep it clean, they're a solid choice.

FN made a fantastic ~$900ish version of the FN15 in a 20in A4 configuration, but it was discontinued. You can find them occasionally for pennies on the dollar on gunbroker. For a complete rifle from FN it is a steal because not a lot of folks ever knew they made such a config, so A4 seeking folks aren't really looking for them.
Presently FN only offers an A4 configuration as the collectors edition with the complete KAC rail system and such and it's much more expensive, as previously mentioned.

Bushmaster (yeah, I know) also makes a fixed carry handle A2 clone variant. An Army buddy of mine got one since that was the 'easy button' for a nostalgic A2 clone for him and he's not super into guns and didn't really know any better. Surprisingly, it has been accurate and trouble free for him. Upon inspection it's actually put together OK aside from poor gas key staking and a slightly too-long gas tube, both of which were easy enough to fix. Feature wise it was spot on for an A2 except the 1/9 HBAR profile barrel, the lack of coating on the sling loops, and the plastic buttstock trap door. At $700-750ish street price out the door, you could do worse.

The PSA A2 clones bug me because they use an F marked FSB, which is slightly shorter than the FSB that's correct for a fixed carry handle. This means you need to run the front sight post up much further to zero and for me it kind of wrecks the immersion/authenticity since it's hard to un-see anything on the front sight and actually still use the rifle. Obviously for an A4 or other flattop setup the F marked FSB is the correct thing. Otherwise it's a PSA product and as long as you're willing to fix the little things that were a little off when they put it together, it should be fine.

CMMG makes/made an A1 length fixed stock with A2 features, which is a nice combo if you want something a little shorter than the A2's pole vault but don't want to mess about with adjustable stocks or carbine stocks, or a vintage A1 stock that's $$$ these days because of retro builders.

Personally, I really like a 20in rifle with a 6 or 7 position carbine extension and an H6-ish buffer. But I'm 5ft 9in and in full battle rattle I find the A2 stock to be a pain in the ass, especially getting in and out of confined spaces. The M4 buttstock makes a big difference in that regard. But the needs for a 'working gun' in that regard differ considerably from a field rifle being used as Mr. Malamute described.



That is a very good price for an LGS. Most rack prices I've seen for a new AR15A4 are in the $1200-1250 range.

My early '90s Colt Sporter Target was a former nuke plant security rifle that I paid $600 for back in '05. It is more enjoyable to shoot than my M4 -ish Armalite DEF-15. Neither have given me any issues with about 1500 rounds collectively fired.

[RAM Engineer]

https://www.brownells.com/rifle-part...rod124803.aspx

Brownells makes a Canadian C7 style upper also.

[OlongJohnson]

The flat top is OK, but I made out OK with handle mounted scope mounts, the ARMS mount being the only one I found that didnt shift zero when the gun lived in the truck leaned against the seat and driven down a lot of rough roads. Getting in and out of vehicles a lot and inside a building the carbines would be better, but none of that has much bearing on my use.

This is interesting.

https://www.brownells.com/optics-mou...rod124965.aspx

[Suvorov]

This is interesting.

https://www.brownells.com/optics-mou...rod124965.aspx

That's funny! I still have mine from the 90's, heck I even paid the money to buy the cheek riser for the "Delta" setup. I guess in a world where hipsters ride single speed bikes through the streets of Portland it makes some sense to bring these back....

[Malamute]

This is interesting.

https://www.brownells.com/optics-mou...rod124965.aspx

I had one of the original Colt scopes like that, it was a good idea at the time, but it had a small field of view, and it also changed zero from my normal use. I never could get it tight enough to stay in place. Using loc-tite in the handle slot to mount surfaces may work, but isnt very removable. They had a bullet drop compensator built into the elevation turret, which was cool, but didnt turn out to be very practical on my gun (Colt SP1).

The only scope mount I found at that time that never changed zero was the ARMS, it was pretty tight going into the carry handle, as in it will remove finish in time, but was reliable for holding zero. It has a hole to use the irons through but it wasnt very quick or easy to do, more like plan B if something happened to the scope. I just adjusted to the higher scope line, but it wasnt as fast to use as a scope that was set up correctly for instant use when you naturally threw the gun up and looked at the target. It made the gun reliable in hitting prairie dogs @ 300 yards consistently with decent ammo. 6-7/10 was common.

http://armsmounts.com/shop/mounts/a-...6-scope-mount/

[Nephrology]

I am pretty happy with my RRA Predator Pursuit upper (20" Natl Match bbl). It is easily sub MOA at 100y with factory match ammo.

It's not a very 'tactical' rifle, but it's easily the best paper-punching rifle I own. Would probably be a great varmint rifle if that was a need of mine.

I'd also skip the MOE stock, mostly because I think the MOE fixed stocks look weird. Classic 20 round mags look best with a classic A1 or A2 style stock, IMHO. If it were my rifle to build, I think I'd go with that CMMG A1 length but A2 style stock for a build like this.

I had both, the fixed MOE stock was much more comfortable and sturdy for the dollar. Most of the A2 stocks I looked at weren't very well made. Best I could find was the Fulton Armory model at ~$130 which included a metal buttplate. I returned it and paid ~$60 for the MOE fixed stock, which had better cheekweld and more storage too. Agreed it doesn't look quite as classic but whatever.

[Doc_Glock]

Here is the new 20” above the old reliable short lightweight.



7lbs 10oz. The smaller rifle including sling, light and optic is 6lb 10oz.

I have to imagine the 20” to be an incredibly sweet shooter.

[Doc_Glock]

I zeroed the 20” today at the indoor range so it is a rough zero. I followed the Colt instructions for zeroing the rifle at 25M using the Z setting on the elevation dial.

I had to dial the front sight down significantly to get centered, maybe 3”. I hope the “Z” setting accounts for the sight offset at 25 yards. Will just have to see once I can stretch it out.

Supposedly this process with the carry handle sight gives a 25/300 zero. I usually use a 100 yard zero on other rifles but thought I would follow Colt’s recommendation here.

I am absolutely amazed that with my eyes, and the crappy indoor lighting and the dark front over the dark bull, I was able to still do 3/4” groups at 25. I am a 4MOA shooter with this ammo using irons and unmagnified sights outside in good lighting, so I guess that is appropriate. Still, the group is smaller than the front sight post by a lot. The old peep sight system is pretty amazing to this pistol shooter.

I then did some close range dots at 5 to learn offset and it went just fine. Amazingly easy firearm to shoot.

Zero functional issues. The trigger is kinda bad, but meh. Will break in.