Heavy Equipment, RFI

[Dan_S]

Looking at purchasing a 30,000 pound-class excavator.

My experience is in running (mostly CAT) equipment. I don’t have the mechanical background that I’m sure some others here do, and as I’m considering purchasing a machine, wanted to collect what opinions I could from the hive-mind here.

Primarily looking at CAT (due to familiarity) John Deere (due to dealer availability in the area the machine will be used) and Case (because...reasons....not necessarily good ones).

For any of you guys working in the oil patch, or working with/on equipment like this, any anecdotes or experiences you care to share? I haven’t used Deere construction equipment, or Case....just farm tractors and such. Do they hold up well? Anyone that’s run/worked on CAT *and* other brands have any reasonable comparative suggestions?



My ‘ideal’ machine would be a (new-ish) CAT 313 with thumb. Don’t need hydraulic couplers and all that, just a basic machine. My former employer has a 315L that has served him very well, and I wouldn’t be opposed to something similar in the 40,000 lb-class either, but would tend to prefer a slightly newer machine that’s slightly smaller in order to stay in the 80-100k price range.

[wvincent]

Kind of depends on how "new" you buy. I used to think that certain manufactures were the best at certain machines: Cat for excavators and dozers, Case for backhoes, Deere for I haven't decided yet. It seems in the current maturity of the market, they are all closer than they have ever been.
Keep in mind, if Deere is the dominant network around you, than you might be best to go that direction. When you are sitting on a job site waiting on a tech, the closer to you the better.

If I had to rank them:
1. Link-Belt
2. Cat
3. Case
4. Deere
There are a bunch of other brands also, but for me, they don't have enough depth in their dealer network for my satisfaction.

I am a custom utility contractor, pretty much everything on the private side of the service. We locate, trench and plow mostly. Water stub outs, well pits and pumps, or electrical service, residential or ag related. Quite a bit of drainage work, tile and lift stations, and crossings/culverts.

I do not have an ex sitting around, I just can't make the numbers work. If I need one, I would rather sub out. If I can't sub out, than I either lease or rent, depending on project duration.

ETA: One nice thing about leasing, I get to try a lot of different machines. If I HAD to go buy an ex today, probably Link-Belt.

[AKDoug]

My largest excavator is a Cat 308, and the rest of mine are mini's. I actually like my Bobcat mini's more than Cat minis, but the Bobcat dealer here sucks. Bobcats are built by Doosan now and if it wasn't for the sucky dealer I'd be looking hard at them.

I've run bigger Cat's, really big Deere's (470G), and quite a few Hitachi's. In my market, Cat has the best parts availability and support, but Deere runs a close second (but another 90 miles of driving). My buddy owns a local excavation company and he runs the piss out of his two Deere 135's. He really wishes they still made the 120 because he could use one lighter machine.

My next excavator purchase will be in the same class as you are looking at. Right now it's going to be Cat getting my money, even though I'll be paying a premium. My mental health is worth a lot of money and my sucky Bobcat/Doosan dealer makes it worth paying 20% more. It's tough finding a good used 312/313 machine in the money range you are looking at.

What are you planning to do with it? My machines are part of my equipment rental company. I use the 308 extensively on my own private land projects. There are times I wish for more, but it really works hard for its size. When I need something bigger I just rent directly from my Cat dealer.

[Dan_S]

Thanks for the replies.


@AKDoug

Machine will be used for clearing land, stumping, building retaining walls, roughing in road/trails, typical ‘excavator’ stuff.

It’ll be my only machine, and I’m really leaning towards buying as I don’t want to dump tens of thousands into hiring all the work out, and not having the machine in the end. I’m quite fortunate to have a job that would allow me to purchase a machine, and by the time I may want to get out, I should have the equipment paid off, and could then roll into my own business doing site work, trucking, who knows....

You see many Kubotas up there? Only been (briefly) in an 080 (20k pound class) machine, and while they’re tempting for the price, I really wasn’t impressed with the ‘mushiness’ of the controls.

@wvincent

What about the link-belt is superior in your view to a similar sized Cat? I don’t see too many of them around on job sites, and I know next to nothing about them, other than....they exist.

[AKDoug]

Thanks for the replies.


@AKDoug

Machine will be used for clearing land, stumping, building retaining walls, roughing in road/trails, typical ‘excavator’ stuff.

It’ll be my only machine, and I’m really leaning towards buying as I don’t want to dump tens of thousands into hiring all the work out, and not having the machine in the end. I’m quite fortunate to have a job that would allow me to purchase a machine, and by the time I may want to get out, I should have the equipment paid off, and could then roll into my own business doing site work, trucking, who knows....

You see many Kubotas up there? Only been (briefly) in an 080 (20k pound class) machine, and while they’re tempting for the price, I really wasn’t impressed with the ‘mushiness’ of the controls.

@wvincent

What about the link-belt is superior in your view to a similar sized Cat? I don’t see too many of them around on job sites, and I know next to nothing about them, other than....they exist.

TONS of Kubotas up here. My largest competitor has dozens of their mini's. He rents them to all the utility companies. I don't know how he does it because there is no support for Kubotas in this state. He gets them cheap from somewhere in the Lower 48 and ships them up. I've never run one, so I don't have any real opinion on them.

I'm in the same boat as you. I have 56 acres that I'm developing into an outdoor music/wedding venue (lots of retaining wall work), an RV park, and putting in my dream home sight on my back 20 acres. I've probably done $50,000 worth of work to date if I'd have had to pay out for the work. I'll admit that it's pretty nice having the machines of my business at my fingertips and being able to deduct them off my taxes. I hope you have a business setup so that you can take advantage of a big purchase like this.

It sounds like you are looking at the right sized machine. I'm doing all that same type of work with my 308, but my trees are probably smaller than yours and the 308 is lacking when it comes to loading dirt in the dumptruck. Of course, I was spoiled with that 470G and 4 yard heaped buckets. The 308 is an excellent machine and very responsive, good rotational speed too. I think the 315 is the largest Cat with a backfill blade, but the 313 matches it's reach and dig depth at a lower price. If this is going to be your only machine, the backfill blade will be indispensable.

You're going to want to buy a small dozer or skid steer for finish work eventually oh..and a beater dump truck..LOL..

[wvincent]

@Dan_S, I don't know where you are located, but one possible thing to keep in mind is that most Cat, Deere, and Case dealers are "blended", meaning they are both Ag and Construction. The downside of that is during planting and harvesting, support becomes a bit more difficult as they get stretched pretty thin.

Regarding the Link-Belt, "feels" and productivity. The control sensitivity was perfect, and those machines just plain worked. Also, I have never seen a Link-Belt sitting on a job site waiting on a tech.

I used to think a 120-160hp excavator was what I needed, then I upgraded my backhoe and never looked back. My Case 580 SN WT will lift and set concrete curbing, concrete septic tanks, concrete pads for transformers and gen sets, and handles my trench box and shielding like a champ. That Power Lift feature is amazing, and my job site mobility is much better than a big ex. Plus back filling is a hell of a lot faster.

Most of what you described for your needs is "grub work" and a excavator will rein supreme. Since Deere is your closest dealer, I would look there first.

@AKDoug, "You're going to want to buy a small dozer or skid steer for finish work eventually..."
Have you seen the Case Minotaur? It's brand new, and looks to fill both of those spots. I can't wait for this machine to come to market.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyG8xzoKkFc

[Dan_S]

Who makes the engine in the link bet machines?


Yeah, the proximity of the Deere dealer would tend to push me in that direction. I have an email out to the Deere shop, so...we shall see what they have to say.

[wvincent]

Who makes the engine in the link bet machines?


Yeah, the proximity of the Deere dealer would tend to push me in that direction. I have an email out to the Deere shop, so...we shall see what they have to say.

Isuzu I believe.

[Dan_S]

Isuzu I believe.

Yeah, I realized I could probably, oh, I dunno, look it up...and yeah, it’s Isuzu, which makes me quite interested.

There’s a dealer locally to where the machine will be (farther then the Deere dealer) so I may check them out.

[wvincent]

Yeah, I realized I could probably, oh, I dunno, look it up...and yeah, it’s Isuzu, which makes me quite interested.

There’s a dealer locally to where the machine will be (farther then the Deere dealer) so I may check them out.

I dunno, maybe you could get them to bring on out for a demo? Might as well make sure you get the one you truly want.