P320 issue in PA

[Bucky]

Tight holster fit might be a collateral benefit but just to clarify, tabbed triggers are an inertia / drop safety not a “manual safety on the trigger.”

True, but there is the added benefit where if a holster is tight enough to drag on the sides of the trigger, it could prevent it from being pulled.

[DpdG]

Given this incident likely involved a duty style holster, I suspect if the holster played any role is was likely too loose, not too tight. Many of the light bearing duty holsters have a gap around the base of the trigger guard big enough that small objects, i.e. strings, key lanyards, etc... can enter the holster directly around the trigger. Best as I can tell, this issue effects pretty much any pistol or duty holster combo using the common x300/TLR-1 style lights, as it is primarily a function of the width of the light.

[Hambo]

Mine fell out of my locker onto the concrete floor. Right on the back of the slide at the "magic" impact angle. No boom.

Bet your butt puckered, though.

[Galbraith]

Bet your butt puckered, though.

Tighter than a snare drum

[OlongJohnson]

The upgrade changed some masses and maybe springs to alter the timing relationships when things are impacted inertially. It didn't fundamentally change the design that I'm aware of. With the Glock action or an S&W SD action, something would have to physically break for the action to lose control of the striker. That is still not the case for the P320. What Tom and others described back at the time was conceptually adding a feature that would physically block rotation of the sear until the trigger bar moved forward; that was not done.

Given that an upgraded P320 can be dropped from several feet onto concrete and not fire, it's hard to think that getting out of a cart somehow led to an inertial impact that caused it to fire. There was probably something else going on.

[Jason M]

There several departments in the SE PA area that field P320 pistols of one variety or another. This is being watched by many with great interest. I do know that at least one job has sought a response directly from Sig to the question “WTF!?!? Y’all said these were now good to go!” I’m curious to see what response they will receive after all the facts of this incident are revealed.

[JHC]

The upgrade changed some masses and maybe springs to alter the timing relationships when things are impacted inertially. It didn't fundamentally change the design that I'm aware of. With the Glock action or an S&W SD action, something would have to physically break for the action to lose control of the striker. That is still not the case for the P320. What Tom and others described back at the time was conceptually adding a feature that would physically block rotation of the sear until the trigger bar moved forward; that was not done.

Given that an upgraded P320 can be dropped from several feet onto concrete and not fire, it's hard to think that getting out of a cart somehow led to an inertial impact that caused it to fire. There was probably something else going on.

Does the thumb safety on say, the M17 block the trigger from moving or the striker from falling? Asking for ~100K friends.

[GJM]

If this was a Glock, we would all be saying let’s see some more information before jumping to conclusions. Since it involves a 320, this just lights the old fire again. I wouldn’t bet either way as to what happened. There are an awful lot of 320 pistols out in circulation, so if they are spontaneously going off, we will know soon.

[jnc36rcpd]

I do't know anything about current management in the SEPTA PD, but it strikes me (no pun intended) that an immediate purchase of new handguns coupled with the loan from Philadelphia PD is significant. Most unintentional discharges are human induced. Police administrators know this. They are also prone to defend themselves and each other. Few want to admit making a significant financial blunder like purchasing unsafe pistols (especially not when the guns are discharging in subway stations). I would have expected an "investigation" or at least suspicion that Officer Smedlap was screwing around with his gun rather than an immediate replacement decision.

That could be due to abssolute proof in SEPTA PD's eyes that the pistol spontaneously discharged or it could be the result of significant anti-SIG opinion in the SEPTA command staff or training cadre.

[John Hearne]

I remain a bit skeptical. As designed the upgraded P320 seems to be a solid design. The striker is physically locked and cannot move forward unless an arm activated by the trigger is pushed up. The only explanations that make sense to me are manipulation of the trigger in some fashion or out of spec parts that are defeating the original design.