magwell holds on an AR-15 are okay for the average home defender

[TGS]

Guys, can we talk for a moment about the "recoil" from an AR15? I'm more likely to push the muzzle around my own-self than have recoil as a factor when shooting a 5.56 gun. Hell, the most annoying part of shooting an AR15 has more to do with hearing and feeling the stupid buffer move in the tube than actual recoil from shooting.

On a target at 25 yards, using an aggressive c-clamp gets me a significant advantage in split times. That advantage is much greater at 50 yards. I don't agree with the notion that recoil on 5.56 and technique to manage it is insignificant in terms of performance on target; recoil in terms of "whoa fuck that hurt my shoulder" obviously not being what we're talking about here. FWIW, at the conclusion of a 3 month course, an instructor came up to me and said that I was the only person in the class who ever shot him when reacting to contact in our force on force scenarios, and that I had done so multiple times.

I was also the only person practicing an aggressive c-clamp grip that actually gave a shit about shooting, regardless of the fact that we did a good amount of shooting and the entire class was taught the c-clamp. It's not just about recoil management...the other side of the coin is being able to drive that sight line to the target and effectuating good hits under stress. I think it makes an even bigger difference under stress when people tend to bounce around and stress kicks in....that's when you're very likely to push the muzzle around on your own by using a subpar technique as opposed to driving that bore onto meat.

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As for the larger question at hand in the OP, I think it's worthwhile to train well if you're going to train at all. Just like training point-shooting is dumb, training to shoot with a magwell grip is a non-starter. If it needs to happen it will happen, but there's no reason to not train in a more effective technique. What's the point of practicing to suck?

As for fatigue, I can't imagine that's going to be a factor in home defense scenarios.

[revchuck38]

There are certainly bigger things to concern oneself with. Like making sure you don't use the PMAGS without over insertion tabs, or USGI mags that don't say Colt or OKAY Industries on the bottom, or using the 64 grain Gold Dots instead of the 62.

What’s wrong with the 62?

OMG, I'm gonna get killt in da streetz. My SHTF mags are loaded with the 55-grain version because the rifle's zeroed with 55-grain. I feel like I'm fixin' to die...

[rob_s]

Is this a troll post?

Yes

[JAD]

solution for getting tired when touting a rifle.. lift weights. .

I was taught a delta ring hold and moved to a c clamp because of the advantage of driving the rifle that TGS talked about. However, ARs are often suggested for home defense (which with i differ) for smaller and less strong people. In addition to being more tiring, a forward hold can cause a small person to push the crap out of the muzzle. That can be overcome in training but I’m sympathetic to the idea that it would be simpler to start from a delta ring hold for a smaller person.

[Hambo]

I actually don't like AFGs or VFGs on my AR, because I've found they are more likely to get hung up on my bathrobe.

I would have paid good money to see you say that to Pat Rogers.

[NH Shooter]

When shooting unsupported prone I use a mag hold with a light grip because that bone-support geometry works well for me in that position (I do the same from a sitting position). From any standing position the support arm gets extended.

[Kyle Reese]

I defend my home with a Glock so I’m posting from the grave

Same. I use a 1301 Tactical for HD.[emoji16]

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

[RevolverRob]

I would have paid good money to see you say that to Pat Rogers.

Since I never had the pleasure of knowing Pat, I’m not sure what his reaction would have been. Fight naked?

But the bathrobe pocket holds a spare mag...

[Jay Cunningham]

I don't think Jay is trolling you guys (well maybe a little).

This.

[Jay Cunningham]

But folks so far have mentioned recoil and control of the rifle during weapon transitions. Are these things that the average home defender needs to be worried about?

When someone advocates the "c clamp" grip on an AR-15, I've usually heard it explained as the best way to aggressively drive the muzzle between multiple threats.

It reminds me of the trend of keeping the stock almost all the way in, until the trend changed to running the stock almost all the way out.

I'm not sure what the current trend is. Split the difference?