Putin built a hypersonic arsenal, while the Pentagon slept

[Risto]

I thought this recent podcast was very informative and would likely be of interest to the PF hive. It'll be worth your time (especially considering current events)

~80% of the discussion is about hypersonic tech and arsenals.

https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-134/


I'm interested in thoughts and comments from our big brained members here.

[Trigger]

Hypersonic weapons development faces four related problems: propulsion, guidance, warhead and thermal management. These articles seem to only focus on propulsion. When I worked these programs, I was content to let the tech continue to simmer and evolve, because the interrelated challenges were so difficult to solve in an integrated weapon system.

Plus some of the employment scenarios were contrived and obtuse. The platform launching the weapon was large, and many hundreds of miles away from the target. Which meant the launching platform could not detect and geolocate the target on it own, which led to datalink, which led to separate target/track sensors, which led to a large dance ensemble just to launch this one weapon to zap this one (possibly) mobile/relocatable target. Uncle.

Vulnerability was another issue, because a hypersonic vehicle glows like a meteor, and attracts every IR sensor within a thousand miles. Plus the aero vehicle was not that maneuverable.

The Russian solution is akin to SRAM of the ‘80s. Not even in the realm of what we have in mind.

[camel]

Much more smarter people than I am. But without the delivery system to timely coordinate such an attack. The only thing that makes a hypersonic is the fact that it deployed relatively fast and was able to boost itself to the speed required to be hypersonic. That just means it’s fast.

[Risto]

Hypersonic weapons development faces four related problems: propulsion, guidance, warhead and thermal management. These articles seem to only focus on propulsion. When I worked these programs, I was content to let the tech continue to simmer and evolve, because the interrelated challenges were so difficult to solve in an integrated weapon system.

Plus some of the employment scenarios were contrived and obtuse. The platform launching the weapon was large, and many hundreds of miles away from the target. Which meant the launching platform could not detect and geolocate the target on it own, which led to datalink, which led to separate target/track sensors, which led to a large dance ensemble just to launch this one weapon to zap this one (possibly) mobile/relocatable target. Uncle.

Vulnerability was another issue, because a hypersonic vehicle glows like a meteor, and attracts every IR sensor within a thousand miles. Plus the aero vehicle was not that maneuverable.

The Russian solution is akin to SRAM of the ‘80s. Not even in the realm of what we have in mind.

Maybe I should have started a new post with just the podcast. The original article is nothing even close to the details and current state of hypersonics discussed in the podcast.

It sounds like much of what you mentioned has been figured out or at least that’s how Mike Griffin portrays the current state of China and Russian affairs. He says this tech is advancing and we are falling quite behind.

[Bergeron]

I would argue that any "sleeping" occurring by US Gov't has been happening with regards to China.

We built the Pershing II solid-fueled Medium Range Ballistic Missile (SRBM) with a Maneuverable Warhead (MARV). You can visit one at the Air & Space Smithsonian on the National Mall in DC. This weapon came online in 1980s, and represented real bleeding-edge technological advancements.

As with any energetic, maneuvering body, there's only a certain envelope of possible maneuvers for the Pershing II:



But that it even maneuvered at all was awesome. We signed the SALT II treaty with the Russians that we obeyed and that they ignored. Meanwhile, China built a conventionally armed Short, Medium, Intermediate-et.al. ballistic missile fleet to point at their neighbors. Then they stole the Pershing, and did something really clever with it- they stuck a conventional warhead on that thing and aimed it out to sea.

I don't know how well any of it works, I don't think anyone who does is (or should) talk. But the Chinese have also been developing their detection platforms, and they've built a no-kidding mobile carrier target out in their own desert.

I'm not saying we need to duplicate our enemy's weapons, or to talk about every weapon system we have- there's a huge history of Communists overstating capabilities. But I do wish that myself as a citizen, and us a country, had more concrete confidence in our ability to counter these systems and operate inside their envelopes.

[MickAK]

We signed the SALT II treaty with the Russians that we obeyed and that they ignored. .

I think you might be confusing SALT II with something else.

[Bergeron]

Oops! You're right- INF! Intermediate Nuclear Forces!