Thought Experiment: ~$60k "performance" Small-ish SUVs

[JAD]

Tires on new cars seem more and more to be like factory sights on a Glock.

They're not THAT bad. Ameriglos are 20% of the cost of the gun; new skins would probably run me 4% of the cost of the car.

What is annoying is that the issues did not evidence until the first downpour. No way to spot that in a test drive.

It also sucks in snow, of which you care not. In general, the handling is so poor that I'm not 100% that it would be fixed with new skins, and I'm unwilling to spend the cash to find out. The car will be sold shortly. The Outback is 100% better than the Benz in literally every axis. If I didn't have an irrational affection for blue propellers, I'd say that someone is crazy to buy something other than an outback in this class.

And yet, I will sell the Outback sooner or later, because it isn't German. I will probably get a pickup truck, because I have a Y chromosome.

Do you have the AMG or the 300?

The 300. For now.

[JAD]

That’s a distinct possibility, but in my case I doubt it’d really be an issue. I’ve only owned one car since moving to S Florida (the rest have all been trucks or SUVs) and I’m not a fan of the low seat height nor the low ground clearance on our roads. I had a coworker once get water in the intake of his 3-series (not an M3, but still) and ruin the engine in a flooded parking lot that I just drove right through in the Tacoma I owned at the time.

I understand your circumstances and the small SUV is a logical alternative to a sedan or wagon in your context. I honestly do think you'd get the most enjoyment out of an X3. The maintenance experience is best in class, the handling is as good as this poor-handling platform gets, and it has the clearance you want.

[Bratch]

Tires on new cars seem more and more to be like factory sights on a Glock.

Do you have the AMG or the 300? It appears that the AMG tires are “225/45R20 front and 285/40R20 rear, all-season Extended Mobility” while the 300 are “235/60R18 front and rear, all-season Extended Mobility”.

I hadn’t notice until now that the front/rear were different sizes on the AMG. That seems annoying from a tire rotation standpoint.

I’d suspect that your other issues would carry over to the AMG, however.

The run flat Pirellis were completely bald at 20,000 miles. After some time on the Google machine this is par for the course. We replaced with Bridgestone Drive Guards with a 60k warranty.

[RJ]

The run flat Pirellis were completely bald at 20,000 miles. After some time on the Google machine this is par for the course. We replaced with Bridgestone Drive Guards with a 60k warranty.

I am attempting to accelerate the wear on my set of Pirellis I have on my car as rapidly as possible. I'm at 21K on the car (bought it used with 19K on it) and the rears are down to just above 3.5 mm. It's a '17 but based on the DOT codes the tires were made in 2018. They are not run-flats but they suck. They are noisy, and very squirmy in the rain.

I have the four replacement Michelin Pilot 4S in my shopping cart at tirerack.com, waiting until I can sneak the purchase past The Boss without her noticing (ok, at least not objecting).

[farscott]

The run flat Pirellis were completely bald at 20,000 miles. After some time on the Google machine this is par for the course. We replaced with Bridgestone Drive Guards with a 60k warranty.

That seems to be par for the course for Pirelli tires. My wife's 2017 Mustang GT came with Pirelli P Zero tires, and we had a belt separation at 24,000 miles. Those were replaced with Michelin Pilot Sports which I suspect will go almost double based on the wear ratings.

[RJ]

I hadn’t notice until now that the front/rear were different sizes on the AMG. That seems annoying from a tire rotation standpoint.

It is, and I've long suspected is purely for "looks". There are few cars that produce sufficient torque that a wider rear contact patch is actually required in the driving conditions the car was designed for (like, the track, say). They do look cool though.

[Bucky]

Timely thread. I’ve been considering trading in my Murano for something with a little more zip. The BMW was looking interesting. Then I started hearing rumors of an SS Blazer, and thought that’d be perfect. Might be too good to be true though.

[RevolverRob]

I am attempting to accelerate the wear on my set of Pirellis I have on my car as rapidly as possible. I'm at 21K on the car (bought it used with 19K on it) and the rears are down to just above 3.5 mm. It's a '17 but based on the DOT codes the tires were made in 2018. They are not run-flats but they suck. They are noisy, and very squirmy in the rain.

I have the four replacement Michelin Pilot 4S in my shopping cart at tirerack.com, waiting until I can sneak the purchase past The Boss without her noticing (ok, at least not objecting).

Are the Pirellis P-Zeroes? You may not find the 4S to be what you want in the scheme of things, depending on how grippy you want.

The Bridgestone Potenza RE-71R is a class leader in 200 TW tires. You certainly won’t get the same life as a set of Michelin 4S, but the grip will be insane, until you step up to the Pilot Sport Cup 2. Also, I think the Bridgestones come out almost 150 bucks cheaper than the French tires.

Don’t get me wrong, love me some Michelins. There are just, potentially, better tires for grip.

The new Yokohama Advan A052s may well take the 200tw crown from the Potenza RE-71R. Early test results indicate better feedback and more consistent performance at high degrees of slip. We’ll see in about 3-weeks what top competitors are running at the SCCA Solo Nationals. The Street Classes by and large require 200TW tires. The top competitors will likely be on Bridgestones or Yokos. We’ll see who comes out on top.

[RevolverRob]

That seems to be par for the course for Pirelli tires. My wife's 2017 Mustang GT came with Pirelli P Zero tires, and we had a belt separation at 24,000 miles. Those were replaced with Michelin Pilot Sports which I suspect will go almost double based on the wear ratings.

Maybe.

24k is decent mileage from a performance tire. They aren’t tires with 40k mile warranties for a reason.

Also bear in mind - exposure to cold and especially wet + cold dramatically decreases the life of performance summer tires. You can think about summer tires as having a life measured in heat cycles rather than miles. The colder the tire starts, the longer the heat cycle, the shorter the life. More highway miles at sustained temperatures gives you longer life. Keeping tires warm, prolongs their lives and allows them to come up to operating temp more quickly. This is why racing teams keep all of their tires wrapped in electric warming blankets.

Still don’t expect any summer tire to exceed 30k miles. And I would honestly not try to push them that far.

Summer tires use rubber compounds that degrade more rapidly than all-seasons. They really have limited lifespans, which you trade for traction.

That said Michelin builds the best tire on the planet for balance tire life and grip. It sacrifices compared to a dedicated grip tire, but for sustained street driving, it’s where it is at. I don’t think it’s a coincidence, that until they shortened the overall mileage route on One Lap of America all top competitors were running Pilot Super Sports. They were the only tires that could consistently give performance and make it through One Lap’s requirement of only 4 tires on the car + one full size spare of at least 200 TW rating.

[RJ]

Are the Pirellis P-Zeroes? You may not find the 4S to be what you want in the scheme of things, depending on how grippy you want.

The Bridgestone Potenza RE-71R is a class leader in 200 TW tires. You certainly won’t get the same life as a set of Michelin 4S, but the grip will be insane, until you step up to the Pilot Sport Cup 2. Also, I think the Bridgestones come out almost 150 bucks cheaper than the French tires.

Don’t get me wrong, love me some Michelins. There are just, potentially, better tires for grip.

The new Yokohama Advan A052s may well take the 200tw crown from the Potenza RE-71R. Early test results indicate better feedback and more consistent performance at high degrees of slip. We’ll see in about 3-weeks what top competitors are running at the SCCA Solo Nationals. The Street Classes by and large require 200TW tires. The top competitors will likely be on Bridgestones or Yokos. We’ll see who comes out on top.

Yep. P Zeros. OEM tire on the 991.2, apparently.

The Goodyear’s on my 981 were worn out, so I did get a set of PS4S before I sold it, which were excellent. Especially here in the wet. And smooth.

I’ll admit buying Michelin’s is almost reflexive after so many years and so many miles over a whole buncha cars. Not a track guy for sure, so overall it’s like hitting the Easy Button for me.