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Thread: Teach me about STI guns

  1. #761
    Quote Originally Posted by CLaw View Post
    Interesting that Mike Pannone posted recently in Instagram about how there are no issues with self-defense ammo.

    I’d love to try one some day, but I’ll just let it all play out right now.

    Besides, I really just want a 92LTT with an RDS... lol
    I don’t and have never found Panone to be a fibber

    What I do find perplexing is the constant changing of models, grips, barrel lengths, optic plate thicknesses, company names and the like - all to confirm that the new models of the duty ready series are more duty-er readier than the ones made 4 months ago by the same guys for the same end user.

    If Sti, or 2011 or 2011 firearms or those guys that make these want the common gun dude to buy a $2400 optic cut 2011 instead of a Roland Glock - Imo it’s going to take more information sharing than is currently coming out.

    And I’m not trying to be rude or step on anyone’s toes. I love these things.

    But they aren’t small, inexpensive or simple so they should be every bit as good as the claim is regardless of who uses them and how.

  2. #762
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Austin,TX
    Couple of things. I have followed Mike Pannone for a long time, I respect him, and he has always seemed like an honest dude. Then again, he’s the “Director of Mil/LE R&D and Training at STI” which is a conflict of interest for a truly objective review. Having carried high end 1911s into harms way and built them since I was very young(I used to visit Chip McCormick at his shop for advice when I was in my teens) I can tell you wholeheartedly that these problems are the very reason I no longer pack one on duty.

    I’m still hopeful that they will get the “recipe” dialed in but I think it’s a mistake to believe that these guns are ready for duty out of the box without a lot of testing(translate that to a bunch of test fires by the end users). Being that STI is a local company and LE friendly I really want them to succeed but it seems they are still tweaking things while riding the Gucci gun wave created by them selling a few guns to the Marshalls SOG (who were running 1911s and didn’t wanna retrain on something new).

    Furthermore I have seen the STI fad come and go since I was a young man with various LE tactical teams and special operations adopting them and getting rid of them for more practical and reliable weapon system. For me a weapon is a “system” when it comes to holsters and training models. There is no sim gun version of the STI...

    I can see the STI being useful in some situations like maybe HR (and especially tubular assaults) where pinpoint accuracy, a huge mag capacity and a safety might come in handy but I’ve never really had a problem with HR headshots with my G34 at room distance so it’s kinda a mute point.

    All that being said, I still want an STI just to support a local company and to get back to my 1911 roots but I’m gonna wait for now.
    Last edited by secondstoryguy; 04-03-2020 at 08:49 PM.

  3. #763
    I still have an open mind, but I was hoping to not have needed to send a $2,500 pistol off right away to a gunsmith. Look forward to getting it optimized for me, and ringing it out against other 9mm pistols.
    Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.

  4. #764
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Southern AZ
    [QUOTE=GJM;1022516]
    Quote Originally Posted by Buck8154 View Post

    Thoughts on 9 vs 45? My local shop, that stocks the line, only has an R in 9 on order.
    I shot both at Nationals last year. The 45 was ok I guess, the 9 was really nice, shot flat and soft, tracked great. If they come up with a way to swap between the single stack and double stack grip module I’d snatch one up with a quickness.

    I got a 9mm (CK arms) 1911 recently and it won’t reliably feed flat point bullets (hollow point profile), fairly common issue with 9mm 1911/2011 platform guns from what I’m hearing after looking into it. Nothing that can’t be massaged into working but kind of a known thing from what I gather.

  5. #765
    My mindset has changed a little since living in a state where I cannot carry. I still have an expectation for "duty" reliability. I still understand that new products will always come with some teething pains. I would like the Staccato to be my one and done: bedside and IDPA/USPSA pistol.

    So up front, I also have an open mind and open eyes on this Staccato journey. And I will not divest from vetted systems either like I did when I thought the USP 9 Tactical was going to be my one and done.

    When this thread hit and I started reading about duty reliability and the 2011, it sparked my interest. I am at the time in my life where I pairing down guns and can splurge a little. I put in an order for what I thought was a 4.15" Staccato P with the treebark Gen 1 grip. In my mind, a vetted pistol in this configuration.

    Long story short, I never got that gun because my local dealer crapped the bed and never ordered it. BUT if he would have, I would have received the 4.15" gun and the Gen 2 grip. The Gen 2 grip is new and you always learn things about new products.

    Fast forward a few months, I get my money back from the dealer and find a lightly used 4.15" gun with a Gen 2 grip. I do not have the high round count due to isolation and range closures, but I admit I am nervous about the Gen 2 mags and Gen 2 grip. My plan was to run up to 2000 rounds quickly.

    There has been a lot of discussion in the last few days on the Lightfighter thread. And magazine base plates are discussed. I am limited in getting magazines to 1 dealer who is willing to block them. All he had were the 20s, so I ordered a few. I am curious what base plates will show up and nervous about hollow points diving. Not sure when the local ranges will re-open...

    Can someone explain why the Dawson Mag Release (for Gen 1 grips) prevents over-insertion whereas the standard STI Gen 2 grip mag release does not? Or does it?

    I am having fun with it. Its been expensive. And I joined another gun forum: 1911 Addicts... they seem to have more 2011 stuff for sale over there.

  6. #766
    Gen 2 grip mag button sits in a different location in the grip - be it higher or lower is no known and therefore existing parts for gen 1 grips dont gel with it.

    As of late STI will say that over insertion isn’t an issue....while directing you to which mag base pad will help with the issue so....Uuh. Yea.


    Around the middle of this thread STI said Over insertion can happen with any semi auto - which is true. In my experience it did happen in 2 cases and the Dawson lock fixed it. A new tuned ejector works too.

    A lot of folks aren’t going to want to mess with that and void their warranty.

    For me I don’t care about the warranty - I want things the way that I want them. The new parts working only as a “closed system” is a total turn off to me and is what led
    Me to spend the better part of $1k having a metal grip and fixed grip safety fitted



    Polymer may soak up recoil to some degree but weight does too. The reason STI won’t do a metal grip imo is a metal grip factory STI would be an infinity. Lol


    Also none of business but I don’t think anyone is watching anyone else daily right now to assure one “can’t carry”

  7. #767
    So, to give me the cliffs notes version, is my brand new 2020 Staccato P DUO likely to feed JHP, and otherwise be reliable with a range of ammo, with the black coated magazines that came with the pistol? If thee is an issue, is it with magazine bodies, magazine springs, the magazine release, or something else?
    Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.

  8. #768
    Quote Originally Posted by GJM View Post
    So, to give me the cliffs notes version, is my brand new 2020 Staccato P DUO likely to feed JHP, and otherwise be reliable with a range of ammo, with the black coated magazines that came with the pistol? If thee is an issue, is it with magazine bodies, magazine springs, the magazine release, or something else?
    Good questions, all.

    Custom builders will say there is no difference in the black and stainless mags.

    To my knowledge STI has not directly claimed that the black is improved in any way - only to say they are good to go out of the box.

    To my knowledge Sti is using Wilson/Nowlin Ramps. Others are using clark/para ramps. Is that a factor ? Who knows.

    From my personal samples the stock mag springs - which are the same length for 126 and 140mm mags - work well for a couple weeks then the nose dives begin as the bullets point into the feed ramp rather than up at it.


    I’m not accusing anyone of being untruthful in claims that the new guns and new mags work.



    I am saying the common gun buyer has a short memory and low tolerance for mystery. If builders of 2011s want to capture the hearts of folks who aren’t passionate and just want it to work, then I feel like a lot more specifics are needed to determine the accuracy of “duty ready “

  9. #769
    Site Supporter JSGlock34's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    USA
    Sounds like too many things changed all at once on the lower - G2 grip, magazine base pads, magazine release...now there are interoperability issues depending on magazine basepad/magwell combinations, as well as some out-of-spec magazine release keys.
    "When the phone rang, Parker was in the garage, killing a man."

  10. #770
    Quote Originally Posted by JSGlock34 View Post
    Sounds like too many things changed all at once on the lower - G2 grip, magazine base pads, magazine release...now there are interoperability issues depending on magazine basepad/magwell combinations, as well as some out-of-spec magazine release keys.
    To a degree I understand this.

    From an engineering aspect they don’t want folks dicking with it.

    To that point - infinity, Cheely, Limcat, etc have proprietary mag buttons for their grips because they want to control the mag insertion height.

    Phoenix trinity supports STI style mag buttons and magwells....but they make it clear their grips are really intended for their frames.

    And yes that’s the same closed system approach I feel like Sti wants to achieve.

    To this point though having spent - a lot- on 2011’s I can get several custom builder folks on the phone for detailed questions. And I always make sure to buy something so I haven’t wasted their time.

    2011 Sti doesn’t provide the same warm and fuzzies to the average Joe. And I get it. I’m one guy not an LE contract buyers or been there done that guy but If I’m not the target buyer I’m not sure what their point is

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