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Thread: "Official Ruger LCR Thread"

  1. #161
    Site Supporter Elwin's Avatar
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    I think I recall Lucky Gunner being up front about that in their intro materials. To be fair to them, it’s prohibitive both cost and logistics wise to use ordinance gelatin to test the huge number of rounds they’ve tested, so if we want that huge array of tests, we’ll have to settle for a compromise (for now). Their use of clear gelatin still allows comparison between the bullets they tested using their test results, even if it doesn’t allow comparison to other tests.

    That said, yeah, getting an idea of what the cited loads are doing would require comparing their results to, say, how 9mm HST or Gold Dots did in the Lucky Gunner tests to get an idea of what’s going on.

  2. #162
    I look at gel to compare one bullet to another...give a a good base line .. But ... How will a bullet react when it strikes a bone ?

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Buckeye63 View Post
    Its found to be difficult to find volunteers to be shot for testing.., until then , different gels and such ..

    Its a comparable test media.. thats it ..
    The part in bold is the problem with the stuff... it isn't consistent over a wide range of velocities (10% Ord gel is). It reacts differently dependent upon velocity, IIRC... so its really only maybe sorta useful for comparing apples to apples, maybe. Vary the velocity much, and comparisons go out the window. I understand why its used by some folks ( its far far easier than using 10% Ord Gel)... but I don't think the "data" it gives is all that great. All that is IMHO. I wont speak for Doc, obviously.

    I suspect if the data it gave was comparable, you'd see the FBI and Military, and ammo companies rushing to use it instead of 10%... but I don't think any of the big ammo makers publish clear gel data. As some folks would say, that's a clue.

    As far as .327 goes, it suffers from the same issues that plague .357 Mag from snubbies: Blast and flash, for not a lot of performance gains. That doesn't mean it isn't suitable for defense use. I think the Gold Dot load ( 115gr?) was decent in real gel... the other factory loads are pretty meh. Handloading something like a Keith style SWC or a SWC-HP might yield okay performance too, but it doesn't do much that other more readily available calibers already do... besides the extra round in the cylinder.

    All that said, if Smith were to offer a J-frame snub in .327 with a six shot cylinder, along with something like a 3-4" "kit gun" (like a 60-4 or 60-10), I'd sorta be inclined to buy one of each. I'd probably load mid-range .32 H&R-ish wadcutters in the snub for carry, and only stoke the hotter loads when needed. Bonus points of Safariland started making Comp-I's and speed strips for .32's too.

  4. #164
    Tactical Nobody Guerrero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by newyork View Post
    I’ve got a 642 I like a lot. These Rugers are getting my attention. The LCR and also that 3” LCRX. They look great.

    Can’t you shoot like 4 calibers in the .327 models? 32 short, 32 long, 32 H&R and .327. Pretty cool.
    This might answer your question (I hope).

    https://www.shootingillustrated.com/...-self-defense/

    If that's true, I might have to look into this more.
    "The victor is not victorious if the vanquished does not consider himself so."
    ― Ennius

  5. #165
    The Henry rifle and more available loads with 6rds and lower recoil have raised the want meter.

  6. #166
    Tactical Nobody Guerrero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by newyork View Post
    The Henry rifle and more available loads with 6rds and lower recoil have raised the want meter.
    Agree. This might be an excellent choice for someone who just wants "a gun," i.e. the "fire extinguisher/sock drawer gun."
    "The victor is not victorious if the vanquished does not consider himself so."
    ― Ennius

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Buckeye63 View Post
    I look at gel to compare one bullet to another...give a a good base line .. But ... How will a bullet react when it strikes a bone ?
    There is an astonishing amount of information in the ammo thread.

    Cliff notes version:. Bone is factored into properly prepared ordinance gelatin outcomes...... You can do your own research on the RCMP testing of bone in OG also

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by Guerrero View Post
    Agree. This might be an excellent choice for someone who just wants "a gun," i.e. the "fire extinguisher/sock drawer gun."
    In New York the government knows about all your handguns so no sock drawer guns for me sadly. Plus, I can’t find in in stock Ruger wheel in stock anywhere.

  9. #169
    The Nostomaniac 03RN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwin View Post
    I think I recall Lucky Gunner being up front about that in their intro materials. To be fair to them, it’s prohibitive both cost and logistics wise to use ordinance gelatin to test the huge number of rounds they’ve tested, so if we want that huge array of tests, we’ll have to settle for a compromise (for now). Their use of clear gelatin still allows comparison between the bullets they tested using their test results, even if it doesn’t allow comparison to other tests.

    That said, yeah, getting an idea of what the cited loads are doing would require comparing their results to, say, how 9mm HST or Gold Dots did in the Lucky Gunner tests to get an idea of what’s going on.
    I totally get how time consuming and expensive using organic gel is. They mention that, then say this "Test results using Clear Ballistics blocks tend to be relatively close to results using organic gelatin, at least for comparing the penetration and expansion properties of handgun bullets."

    Then this

    "The goal of our project is to test as many loads as possible in order to determine how they compare to the FBI standard recommended penetration depth of 12-18″. We also want to know how well the bullets expand when they encounter a barrier of heavy clothing before entering the gel. Whenever feasible, we tried to duplicate the testing protocol reportedly used by the FBI, but our first priority was to be consistent, using the same procedure and conditions for every load we tested."

    Both those statements are misleading.

  10. #170
    The Nostomaniac 03RN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buckeye63 View Post
    I look at gel to compare one bullet to another...give a a good base line .. But ... How will a bullet react when it strikes a bone ?
    Auto glass gives a close representation of bone.

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