The Shit Storm that is the NRA Today & How We Got Here

[RoyGBiv]

Also, I'd probably be violating my fiduciary duty to not point out that donations can be made directly to ILA, and, per the bylaws, those funds can only be used by ILA. We also have NRA-PVF and NRA Victory Fund (Super PAC). Donations to those will be used for political purposes.

I suppose it's worth asking, since I'm wondering about it.....

If ILA gets assigned a budget from NRA (Board) of (hypothetically) $1M for the fiscal year and direct donations to ILA exceed $1M.... is the allocated budget reduced accordingly?

It might feel better giving directly to ILA, but only with some assurance that monies otherwise budgeted from HQ don't get offset by direct donations to ILA.

Sorry for the confusing language... Not sure how to ask this more succinctly.

[Eric_L]

I totally get that. I was just pointing out that contrary to implication in the post I quoted, we are doing quite a lot.

Also, I'd probably be violating my fiduciary duty to not point out that donations can be made directly to ILA, and, per the bylaws, those funds can only be used by ILA. We also have NRA-PVF and NRA Victory Fund (Super PAC). Donations to those will be used for political purposes.

Well if it is in the bylaws then it is sacrosanct…. The money is safe. Forgive my sarcasm, but it IS CLEAR from looking at the recent court proceedings that bylaws are not sacrosanct.

[Catshooter]

I totally get that. I was just pointing out that contrary to implication in the post I quoted, we are doing quite a lot.

and, per the bylaws, those funds can only be used by ILA.

Josh,

I don't know you but I have to assume you work for the NRA? Ok. I mean no offense to you, and am not specifically targeting you as I do not know you or your position in the NRA, but while I think that defeating the Chipman nomination was very important I hardly look at that alone as "doing quite a lot." The NRA, at least in my tiny little mind should be/have done a whole lot more. Nor was the NRA alone in that effort.

I live in South Dakota and we've not needed the NRAs help for many years, but I know people in other states that oh Lord are in dire straights. The list of states that are loosing ground badly is quite extensive.

And "per the bylaws"? Really? Isn't that somewhat naïve? I'm not sure Wayne is paying all that much attention to those pesky things.

I also disagree that the NRA shouldn't work with other groups. Sometimes calling the tyrants what they are is the right road to follow. The asshole that is my Representative voted the wrong way just recently and my email was strongly worded, including threating him with the mid-terms. Those other groups are full of smart, well intentioned people and since when is being divided stronger? That's how we fall.


Cat

[NEPAKevin]

Josh,

I don't know you but I have to assume you work for the NRA? Ok. I mean no offense to you, and am not specifically targeting you as I do not know you or your position in the NRA, ...

Cat

If you look at the member's list and sort by join date, you will see Josh listed in the first dozen or so members. (clue 1)
If you read his many posts over the years, he is pretty open about where he works and what they do. (clue 2)
If you look after those posts, you will often notice posts from other long time members thanking him for the good work they do. (clue 3)
I understand the the frustration of reading about Wayne's shenanigans and have even expressed my own misgivings about the current "shit storm" and completely agree with the "not one more penny" until the problems are fixed sentiment. That said, there is a reason why the left is attacking the NRA and I do not believe that infighting within the second amendment community is or has ever been particularly helpful. So, I'm basically agreeing with you but adding that it goes both ways.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

There is a difference between infighting in an organization because the parties want personal gain as compared to acknowledging a problem in leadership that is detrimental to the cause. Loyalty to a crazed or incompetent leader because some folks have a psychological need to be dominated or that they think they will personally gain and the hell with everything- has taken down organizations and governments from local to national for many centuries.

WLP is detrimental to the RKBA cause as compared to other possible leaders. It is without honor to stay when you are a detriment. However, psychological forces from cognitive delusions to greed prevent folks from doing the right thing.

[Eric_L]

If you look at the member's list and sort by join date, you will see Josh listed in the first dozen or so members. (clue 1)
If you read his many posts over the years, he is pretty open about where he works and what they do. (clue 2)
If you look after those posts, you will often notice posts from other long time members thanking him for the good work they do. (clue 3)
I understand the the frustration of reading about Wayne's shenanigans and have even expressed my own misgivings about the current "shit storm" and completely agree with the "not one more penny" until the problems are fixed sentiment. That said, there is a reason why the left is attacking the NRA and I do not believe that infighting within the second amendment community is or has ever been particularly helpful. So, I'm basically agreeing with you but adding that it goes both ways.

I am sure Josh is a decent person. However, I have directly asked a couple questions without response. He is quick to point out reassuring niceties, such as the bylaws are followed. However, it is clear from reading court papers and answers that bylaws are not followed. It is also clear that there is malfeasance. And I recall reading that the ILA had five million pulled from it by NRA proper (if wrong, I’ll own up to it, this is not a libelous attack) it leaves me wondering at the reassurances.

[BillSWPA]

Joshs is a lawyer in the Institute for Legislative action. The fact that the leadership of an organization desperately needs to be replaced does not mean everyone in the organization is bad. Sometimes a good lawyer gets stuck with a not so good client, which seems to be what happened here. He is doing the best that can be done under the circumstances.

[Catshooter]

NEPAKevin,

Yeah, I was trying to make it clear that I had no intention of attacking him personally. Except for leaning a bit on him for the bylaws thing, which I do disagree with him on. It's nice to be nice, but nice can easily be carried to far. Glenn makes a very good and applicable point.


Cat

[Catshooter]

For the want of a nail . . .

There is a difference between infighting in an organization because the parties want personal gain as compared to acknowledging a problem in leadership that is detrimental to the cause. Loyalty to a crazed or incompetent leader because some folks have a psychological need to be dominated or that they think they will personally gain and the hell with everything- has taken down organizations and governments from local to national for many centuries.

WLP is detrimental to the RKBA cause as compared to other possible leaders. It is without honor to stay when you are a detriment. However, psychological forces from cognitive delusions to greed prevent folks from doing the right thing.

Who knows how long the corruption has been going on, I don't, but Wayne has held his position for about 30 years now. Just imagine if you will what sort of shape the 2A could be in if he & his cronies had kept their noses faithfully on their stated purposes. But they didn't.

Now imagine a very weak NRA (and probably, horribly) a dying one. And the right person in the right position to make it happen decides now is the time and some harsh and sweeping legislation gets passed at the Fed level. Is this the beginning of war/civil war?

Farfetched, I'm sure. I hope . . .

[joshs]

I am sure Josh is a decent person. However, I have directly asked a couple questions without response. He is quick to point out reassuring niceties, such as the bylaws are followed. However, it is clear from reading court papers and answers that bylaws are not followed. It is also clear that there is malfeasance. And I recall reading that the ILA had five million pulled from it by NRA proper (if wrong, I’ll own up to it, this is not a libelous attack) it leaves me wondering at the reassurances.

Sorry, I haven't been able to jump on here for a few days. I'm not aware of even an alleged violation of the bylaws that ILA took part in. I can assure you that current ILA leadership has no intention of giving up donations that we raise.

Also, donations to NRA-PVF will only be used for political purposes. Some people just don't like giving to NRA-PVF because they don't want to engage in election politics.

Sorry for the short reply. I'll have more time to jump on here next week.

ETA: If you're looking at many of our court filings, you should read the deposition of Sonya Rowling in the bankruptcy case. It details that she was one of the people who came forward with concerns over financial issues in 2018. She is now the Treasurer of the NRA. If we weren't serious about cleaning house, why would we make a whistleblower our chief financial officer? Similar changes have occurred throughout the building. I know everyone is focused on a change at one position, but there is progress on many others.