Mine came back just fine, still, I think it'd be worth a call to see if they can work on it, the worse they could say is no..Originally Posted by HCM
Mine came back just fine, still, I think it'd be worth a call to see if they can work on it, the worse they could say is no..
Last edited by ralph; 06-15-2019 at 11:35 AM.
Interesting. Thanks for the info. When cocking the hammer slowly, it does not usually click into place before full cock. I’d say less than 50% of the time. Pulling slowly in DA... it’s harder to tell, but I can’t really perceive a click just before the hammer falls. But it seems to be lined up correctly. As I said, it shots fine, both in DA and SA. Though I’m not sure I’ve ever cocked it slooowwly, when shooting at the range. I just don’t want the gun to be unsafe.
I haven’t noticed anything like that... but I haven’t really been looking either.
Generally a gun will fail the function check in DA, while passing in SA (when you cock the hammer it will lock up) unless it's got serious mileage on it. It sounds like yours definitely needs a tune up.
I have a 28-2 this way and just haven't had the time to address it yet. Here's how my 28-2 is, and this is pretty typical.
1) Cocking for SA the cylinder stop locks in on all chambers.
2) Slowly working the trigger in DA, the cylinder stop will lock up before hammer fall on 4 chambers, but not the other 2.
3) End shake can be out or not. On mine it's within acceptable limits, a very tight .006".
I do shoot this gun on occasion. It doesn't spit or shave. If running at a somewhat "normal" pace they are generally fine, the momentum of the cylinder will carry up to the cylinder stop just fine. However when running balls out doing Bill drills or something, that asshole Murphy changes his name to Skip Chambers. That's when you get into trouble.
FYI, I also have a 19 that is slow in DA on every chamber. That gun was my dad's, he bought it new, and I bet it doesn't have 300 rounds through it and almost no dryfire. It left the factory that way. I don't sweat it, but I will fix it when I get time.
Last edited by Spartan1980; 06-15-2019 at 03:24 PM.
There were some good guys at the S&W warranty stations until S&W yanked their contracts.
Frank Smith, LSG Manufacturing, did good work on retiming my Model 15 (no dash). (325) 885-2700.
If we have to march off into the next world, let us walk there on the bodies of our enemies.
If it were spitting lead or jacket fragments, you'd likely notice it.
It's also worth pointing out that many, if not most, S&W's--particularly those made after the late 1960s--were not perfectly timed when they were new and the handling habits of many revolver owners (slapping the cylinder shut, etc.) are not conducive to keeping a S&W in time. My rule of thumb with my S&W's (and applicable only to me and my needs; not saying it is the only rule or best rule) is that I don't worry about timing until I start to see a change in the pattern of leading and fouling at the forcing cone indicating that one, or more, cylinders are not achieving an adequate alignment--note adequate alignment. S&W's, from the factory, are not comparable to perfectly aligned revolvers like a Freedom Arms or a custom revolver with a line-bored cylinder and an oversized, blocked hand.
To my mind, a revolver being out of time only becomes a safety issue when you begin to get lead and jacket fragments spitting out the sides of the forcing cone. I've been on the firing line at IHMSA matches and been spattered by fragments from revolver shooters next to me whose S&W's and Dan Wessons were shot out-of-time by years of heavy loads. One reason I always wear wrap-around eye protection.
Last edited by oregon45; 06-15-2019 at 03:40 PM.
What you're describing refers to "carry up" -- a revolver either does or does not carry up, in gunsmith terms. ("Timing" refers to the mechanical process that results in a proper alignment (know as "index") between the charge hole and the barrel -- it all interconnects, but there is a distinction and the terms often incorrectly used interchangeably.
You may be experiencing DNCU (does not carry up), but to properly check carry up on the older S&Ws (pre-mid-90s before the change in extractor design), you need to use either snap caps or empty cases in the charge holes.
Let me reiterate for safety's sake: SNAP CAPS OR EMPTY CASES.
This is because the slight play in the old extractors -- especially if one or both of the alignment pins is missing (not uncommon) -- can create a DNCU false positive if there are no caps or cases to maintain alignment.
Checking carry up with the caps or cases rather than with empty charge holes often yields proper carry up where it appeared not to, and is identical to how you'd be shooting with live rounds. Cycle through the complete cylinder in single and double action, slowly, confirming that the cylinder stop engages the cylinder notch before the hammer cocks (in single action) and before the hammer falls (in double action).
If with proper check you confirm DNCU, seek a qualified revolversmith for a thorough walk-through and refresh.
Last edited by Wingate's Hairbrush; 06-15-2019 at 06:00 PM.
Hain’t we got all the fools in town on our side? And ain’t that a big enough majority in any town?
I'm sorry to share that it was reported on the S&W Forum this week that Frank Smith has passed.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smi...=frank%2Asmith
Hain’t we got all the fools in town on our side? And ain’t that a big enough majority in any town?
Classic carry-up problem. Not much to diagnose, send it to a real gunsmith, as it will not improve with time. Or put a new hand on yourself. This used to be standard stuff for any local gunsmith to fix (kinda like tuning carbs and adjusting points used to be be normal) but most local gunsmiths are no longer good at this stuff, unless they are pretty old school.
I have used Clarks a bunch. Ten Ring Precision in San Antonio is also excellent, but they're pretty used to hand delivery; people usually drive there to drop stuff off in person. Both are good but they might have your gun for a month. If there's a gunsmith on here allota people like, might be a good route as well.
Thanks to everyone for the advice and insight. I think Wingate's advice to test for carry up with empty cases/snap caps is a good place to start. Failing that, I'll consider a smith. Strange, though, that most guns fail this test in DA, while passing in SA--mine seems the opposite. Though, to be fair, I can't exactly tell if it's achieving full lock on the DA pull... seems to happen pretty close to when the hammer falls, if it's happening at all.
Based on the opinions here (and my experience shooting the gun) doesn't seem to be a safety issue--didn't notice any slag jetting out of the cylinder gap. Nonetheless, I'd like to get it corrected before I do a lot of shooting with it. And if it passes the carry up tests with a spent case, seems like it's a non-issue anyway.
The guy who sold me the gun said it was either unfired, or had been only a handful of times. It looks nearly new, so I was inclined to believe him. Still has the original box and credit card slip from the original purchase, in 1980. I was thrilled to find such a nice one (esp pinned and recessed), so I'd like to hang onto it. Long story short... doesn't seem like it's worn out. It's a 2.5 inch, in case that's somehow relevant.
I'll report back once I try it with some empty cases. Might check with S&W, or, there's a guy here in town that has a pretty good reputation (Schlosser Gunsmithing in Newport, KY--if anyone's familiar with the area). I had him do some sight work, and saw revolvers in various stages of disassembly on the bench. As well as a Luger or two.
Anyway, thanks again for all the input.
-Matt
Also, sorry to hear about the passing of Frank Smith, the gunsmith that was recommended. Seems like it was very recent.
Last edited by MattyD380; 06-15-2019 at 07:38 PM.
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