Bad batch of primers?

[TOTS]

So I have loaded up around two thousand rnds of 124 gr rn using Winchester small pistol primers. This is my normal primer that I have used for the last couple of years: 124 gr rn bullet over 3.9 gr Titegroup in mixed brass. I’ve been using this recipe since I developed the load and have never until the last K had the primers delaminate instead of pop out during the decapping step of reloading. Only 1 out of every 30 or so, but that’s still brass I have to trash. Basically the cup delaminates from the sidewalls of the primers where the decapping pin contacts it and the remaining cylinder stays seated in the pocket. Just wondering if anyone has ever seen this. Brass has multiple loadings, is from multiple manufacturers, and is wet tumbled. Nothing is different than the last multiple thousand loaded with the exception of a new case of primers.

[WDR]

I have heard of this happening with wet tumbled cases that do not get dried out well (put in a hot oven/dehydrator etc) after the wet tumbling. Corrosion forms in the primer/pocket from residual water if the cases sit around a while before processing, which "glues" them in the pocket, and you end up with punched primer cups. Are you drying the cases out in some way?

I'm also seeing some military crimped cases in there... are the crimps swaged or otherwise removed?

ETA: You could have a bad batch of primers, but I've never personally ran into that problem short of heavily crimped military brass... if everything else seems in order, it may be worth a phone call or e-mail to Winchester.

[358156hp]

There was nothing wrong with the primers. Your pic shows the number one reason against wet tumbling brass with the primers in place. You didn't mention what method you used to dry the brass, but you did not get all the water removed from the primer pockets when you dried them and corrosion resulted between the primer pocket and the side walls of the primer. This is why the primers are stuck in place. The shoulder or corners of the primer are a weak point with that 90 degree bend, so that's where the break occurred. I have successfully removed some "ringers" as some have called them, but the easiest solution is simply to avoid the situation entirely. I now dry tumble fired brass to remove dirt & grit, then size them on the single stage in carbide dies and then I wet tumble them. Others have had success drying the wet tumbled brass in a really low temp oven for an hour or so, but some ringers are still reported. Whenever I get one, I toss the brass and move on. How much effort is a two cent piece of brass worth?

I once bought a large lot of once-fired surplus 5.56 brass that had gotten wet. I quickly learned why it was so cheap!

[Jim Watson]

Yup.
Known in the trade as "Ringers." Commercial reloading machines have Ringer Detectors to keep such cases from hanging up the system or popping primers.

I have some purchased "once fired" .45s that were probably wet cleaned that will deliver an occasional ringer.
I don't wet clean smokeless brass but I still get a 9mm ringer every now and then. Probably a range pickup that has lain out in the weather a while.

[CCT125US]

I have not experienced this with wet tumbled brass. However, I use a food dehydrator until the brass is too hot to touch.

[AJLooch]

I have reloaded and worked in the reloading industry for over 20 years and will never understand the allure of wet tumbling for progressive reloading.

[TOTS]

Hmm, still seems like corrosion wouldn’t form in the pocket as the old primer is sealing the pocket till the new one is seated. And I know everything is completely dry as I lay a single layer of wet tumbled (sans ss pins) brass on a towel in a garage floor (100 degree summer heat lately) for anywhere from a week when I’m not traveling to a month when I am. And then it usually goes into an ammo can for God knows how long. But it’s definitely dry!

I’m still clueless as to why I haven’t seen this until recently; I’ve been doing the same procedures for the last 7 years and have never had ‘ringers’ before. And then having so many so quickly made me question what was different. I cut the crimp out with a lyman case prep machine. The bulk of the ringers were with the LC brass so I did wonder if the crimp wasn’t completely removed. But the wide range of brands with occurrences confuses this. And I have traditionally used primarily mil brass.

Regardless I’m glad others have seen this before and appreciate the dropped knowledge!

[LittleLebowski]

I have reloaded and worked in the reloading industry for over 20 years and will never understand the allure of wet tumbling for progressive reloading.

What about dry tumbling using media? I think there would be more problems with the dry media, no?

[Hambo]

What about dry tumbling using media? I think there would be more problems with the dry media, no?

If you mean walnut shell, etc, the problems are that it can clump up in a case, or if tumbling deprimed cases bits of media can get stuck in the primer hole.

[Sal Picante]

What about dry tumbling using media? I think there would be more problems with the dry media, no?

Good post-tumbling brass processing pretty much eliminates a lot of that... E.g. you can check for a clump or etc, but it is hard to "check" for glued-in primer pockets...