That is exactly the issue that has prevented me from buying a Baer Commanche 38 Super. They still build them that way.Originally Posted by farscott
I have a Custom Shop Commander Elite 45 that has well over a thousand rounds through it now with no signs of wear and no functional issues.
I've had two bushingless Wilson 4", and I'll agree that they were ultra smooth, throughout the cycle of operation
And I still have a Commanche in the safe that needs someone to remachine the VIS.
In the spirit of the current SIG thread, are we good with Kimber now? Especially if we understand they’re trading on a name made 20+ years ago? Actually that describes a lot of companies but that’s not important right now...
As long as I’m on this train of thought, how are SIGs 1911s when you get past the gimmicky finishes and marketing?
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits - Mark Twain
Tact is the knack of making a point without making an enemy / Where is the wisdom we have lost in knowledge?
On Kimber, the best buy is the least expensive pistol without the firing pin safety. The higher priced guns add mostly cosmetic gimmicks. The issue is that the Kimber firing pin safety relies on the grip safety being depressed to deactivate the firing pin safety. While a good idea in theory, practice has shown it is possible to depress the grip safety enough to allow the trigger to release the sear while the firing pin safety is partially engaged. That leads to light strikes, no strikes, and/or firing pin/firing pin plunger damage.
On SIG, the non-standard slide profile often requires holsters molded to that slide profile. Plus you are dealing with SIG. With all of the other choices for 1911, I see no compelling reason to choose SIG. The only SIG 1911 that was rock solid was the original GSR (Granite Series Rail pistols, not the Revolution models) that used Caspian frames and slides. The parts suppliers to SIG for the GSR were believed to be Grieder Precision slide stops, magazine catches, and plunger tubes; EGW sears and bushings; Performance Engineering hammers, grip screws, and bushings; Wolff Springs; Storm Lake barrels; stocks by Herrett's or Falcon; ACT magazines; and Novak Sights. It is believed the first run was put together by Matt McLearn's team. SIG had little to do with the manufacturing of the actual parts in the GSR and later screwed Caspian who sold the remaining pistols in kit form.
I'm still pretty leery of Kimber, however I do own a stainless 9mm government model and I will tell you right now that it has been quite a bit better than my Colt 9mm Commander. Here meaning, "It required me to do fewer things to it to make it run the way I liked".
On my Colt I replaced the rear sight, the extractor, the thumb safety and most notably, the barrel. I also had to file the ejector so it wouldn't get hit by the top round of the magazine, and so it wouldn't keep ejecting every round into my face.
The Kimber only required a new extractor. Granted it would probably benefit from a new barrel, but 2-2.5" groups with the factory tube are better than the 4-6" groups I was getting with the Colt's factory tube.
The Sig 1911s aren't that bad actually. The main gripe I have is that the slide is different so holster fit is not the same, and they're fugly. Sig changed this up by offering a traditional profile slide. Tim Herron actually used a 9mm version as his teaching gun when I took a class with him, and the gun seemed to work OK.
The other concern I have is that external extractor. If it's not set up right from the factory it used to mean you were hosed because there were no replacements. Fortunately, EGW resolved that problem and makes a replacement piece that could be tuned to the individual gun.
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Kimber let all their gunsmiths go except for one. My buddy shoots with the survivor and he is getting the heave-ho soon. Perhaps Kimber is planning on producing a flawless product.
I was issued a SIG 1911 (traditional slide profile) for several years on SWAT. They actually functioned better than I expected, but we still had some problems. I lost count of how many guns we had the sights fall off of, mag wells coming loose, etc.
Good stuff, thanks!
My interest in Kimber is based on the new optic ready 9mm for giggles. The only reason I asked about SIG is for those times I run across one under priced under market value.
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits - Mark Twain
Tact is the knack of making a point without making an enemy / Where is the wisdom we have lost in knowledge?
Some good answers already.
Kimber -- anything with the "II" in the name means it has the dreaded firing pin safety. Yuck. The Colt Series 80 system is really the only 1911 firing pin safety I'm okay with.
Sig -- their first generation 1911s were actually really well built, though I didn't like the non-standard slide dimensions. Since then they have changed their process and the parts used. You can probably get a good one, but no guarantee.
I used to be of the opinion that if you bought a production line gun from Colt, Sig, S&W, Kimber, Springfield Armory, etc... you were likely to get a gun that works just fine. That had been based on my experiences before I started shooting a lot more, taking classes, etc... I still think you can get a good gun that way, but my current thinking is that with 1911s it can pay off to invest more in the gun up front. That's why just about all the 1911s I currently own that get used a lot are from the Colt Custom Shop. There is just that significant of a difference in build quality and function.
Best Kimber I had was a 5" model with the (short-lived) revised external extractor. It ran as well as any gun I've had.
The three 4" Kimbers I had were another story. They all had issues, and one went back to the factory twice and still wouldn't run.
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