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Thread: Stranger in your backyard

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by BigD View Post
    Not trying to troll you, nor am I trying to take the thread off on a tangent. I choose to believe you when you say that you have never woken up in the middle of the night and went to the fridge to get a glass of milk without strapping on your blaster (or carrying it down the stairs at temple index).

    But, am I in the minority here because I will admit that I have stepped foot out of my house unarmed? Are most of us here that vigilant and that dedicated to 24/7 carry?




    Maybe the adage I read on a previous thread applies - "Anyone that carries more than me is a paranoid nut, and anyone that carries less than I do doesn't care about his family's safety." (paraphrased)
    Reading the first post in this thread made it painfully obvious to me, that there are times when I step outside, I could be caught flat-footed and unarmed.
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  2. #22
    Member Leroy Suggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypher View Post
    Nobody's perfect but I really do go by the rule "If I'm wearing clothes I'm carrying a gun." I don't really see a Glock 26 being all that much to carry.

    As for going outside I had two guys try to rob me one night while I was putting my stuff in my car. I was able to stop them because I was armed. I didn't really ever go outside unarmed before that happened and I certainly haven't gone out the front door unarmed since it happened.
    If I am wearing clothes there is a G19 attached.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leroy Suggs View Post
    If I am wearing clothes there is a G19 attached.
    Since a G19 is bigger than a 26 does that mean you're more paranoid than me?

    This is one of those topics that come up over and over again and every time it does someone makes a comment to the effect of "I can't imagine being so fearful that I feel the need to carry a gun in my home.". They then go on to tell us they have multiple guns stashed all over their house. Wait, what?

    I don't always carry at home because I'm not always dressed to carry. I'm currently sitting on my couch in sweats and a T Shirt I have a a Glock 26 with a 12 round magazine sitting on the table next to me. If I move to a different part of the house it goes with me. If I'm wearing clothes that will support a gun then I wear a gun. Usually the 26 which really isn't that much to carry.

    I read a blog by Tamara Keel once that says (paraphrased) " It's not so much that I carry a gun at home as it is that I simply carry a gun." I carry at home 1% for "just in case" and 99% because if I have to take the dogs out or SWMBO sends me to Walmart I don't have to stop and put my gun on.

    On a side note I also don't specifically answer my door armed. If I'm concerned enough about who's on the other side of that door that I won't open it without a gun in my hand I just don't open the door.
    Last edited by Cypher; 04-01-2019 at 03:29 PM.

  4. #24
    If you are ensconced inside of your residence there are very few good reasons (absent a rescue of those on your personal priority list) to go outside to challenge anyone.

    Lives above property, family lives above all others.

  5. #25
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    J/K.

    Sounds like you handled it pretty well, all things considered.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray01 View Post
    If you are ensconced inside of your residence there are very few good reasons (absent a rescue of those on your personal priority list) to go outside to challenge anyone.

    Lives above property, family lives above all others.
    This came up in another thread and I remember the general concensus being you give up your claim to self defense as soon as you leave your home.

    It's approximately page 13 of the "Lock Your Door" thread. This post in particular.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed L View Post
    I don't know that a prosecutor ever said, "Well, you went outside." But it seems an obvious question to me and something that is easily avoidable by not going outside in such a situation. In general principle, to justify the use of lethal force there has to be the unavoidable danger of death or serious physical injury. If you knowingly leave the safety of your house to face someone, you have just removed the unavoidable part.

    Self defense is far more clear cut if you stay inside, rather than going outside to confront or investigate a suspicious person who was otherwise not a threat to you or anyone else.
    It weakens your assertion that you were in fear of your life when you leave the safety of your locked house to face, confront, or investigate someone.

    To quote Tom Givens: "Never go looking for trouble without expecting to find it. In just about every single instance I know of where a permit holder or other lawfully armed citizen was charged after a shooting, he went outside his home or vehicle to confront someone "suspicious" or involved in some petty behavior like vandalism. You will get all the heartache you need in this world without going out of your way to get more."

    You are in a better tactical and stronger legal position if you stay in your house and shoot them when they are in the process of breaking into your house. This removes any doubt of their intention. There are laws on the book in both NY and CA that justify the use of deadly physical force against someone in an occupied house. In NY you can use deadly physical force to terminate a burglary or an attempted burglary: http://law.onecle.com/new-york/penal....20_35.20.html.

    There are indeed a number of cases where people left the safety of their house to investigate or confront someone who was otherwise not a direct threat to their physical safety and suffered legal consequences. Had the people stayed inside of the houses, none of the shootings would have happened. Here are a few I can think of off the top of my head.

    First, there was one that the Late Todd G related the incident of a Judge who shot someone who was threatening him and wound up getting charged. When I further asked him about it, he told me that the judge armed himself and went out on the porch to confront the guy. It would have been a different matter if the guy broke into his house.

    Second, there was a situation that Massad Ayoob wrote about where someone armed himself and opened the door to "discuss his situation" with someone who believed the homeowner was having an affair with his wife. The larger man assaulted the homeowner and the homeowner wound up shooting him and killing him. The homeowner went on trial.

    Third, the famous case of the guy in Louisiana who left his house to confront someone who knocked on one door and then the other and when the homeowner faced the person and ordered him to freeze he refused the man's order to freeze and approached him and the homeowner shot and killed him and it resulted in a nationally famous trial: https://www.upi.com/Archives/1993/05...6184737697600/

    If the person had remained inside all of these would have been avoided. Or if the person outside tried to break in, the person who shot them would have been in a much stronger legal situation and might not have even gone to trial. Look at the number of people shoot burglars in their own home who do not go to trial, unless they do something incredibly stupid that puts them outside of the law. Staying inside sacrifices nothing and gives you both a legal and tactical advantage.
    Last edited by Cypher; 04-01-2019 at 03:57 PM.

  7. #27
    Member GuanoLoco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigD View Post
    Not trying to troll you, nor am I trying to take the thread off on a tangent. I choose to believe you when you say that you have never woken up in the middle of the night and went to the fridge to get a glass of milk without strapping on your blaster (or carrying it down the stairs at temple index).

    But, am I in the minority here because I will admit that I have stepped foot out of my house unarmed? Are most of us here that vigilant and that dedicated to 24/7 carry?




    Maybe the adage I read on a previous thread applies - "Anyone that carries more than me is a paranoid nut, and anyone that carries less than I do doesn't care about his family's safety." (paraphrased)
    I went to run an errand today and realized half way there that I didn't have my trusty P-07 on me. I felt a sense of vulnerability, irresponsibility, shame, and embarrassment. I was driving my wife's car and didn't have a backup in a console vault. More shame. I considered turning around, but I wouldn't have been able to complete my errand in the mid-day time slot available. So I went almost naked with 2 knives, 2 flashlights, a useless reload and a small can of Sabre Red.

    It was a horrifying experience and I learned my lesson.
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  8. #28
    With regards to the "when do you carry" part of this, I treat carrying as if it's my right hand punch extended to 15 yards, and I expect it to be there anytime I may be surprised and need it.

    I'll leave any fight I can, at the same time if I find myself in unexpected mortal danger I want to be able to "punch" at distance if I have the time and space. I always want to have my right hand on me so that my decision making matrix for dealing with mortal danger doesn't change, ever.

    Bathrobe is the only thing I don't have at least a G26 under.
    Anywhere outside my house, there's a spare mag, since the only stoppage I've had in my primary was magazine related.
    Last edited by STI; 04-01-2019 at 05:13 PM.

  9. #29
    Member Baldanders's Avatar
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    I am almost always carrying around my 12 acre "yard," mostly because of critters. Often open carry (mowed for the first time this season with my Trooper Mk.III in a thumb break holster) and a concealed piece at the same time.

    Anyone showing up in my backyard unannounced has already tresspassed accross two or three neighbors' properties. If I am lucky, LE would make it here in under a half hour after a call. If I am in the house, I would be grabbing a 12 gauge while my wife calls it in while I yell out the window at the intruder. Then wife would be grabbing PCC.

    We don't get to many wandering folks on foot my neck of the woods. Used to get more people who were "lost" driving up, but that is rare now too.
    Last edited by Baldanders; 04-01-2019 at 05:27 PM.
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  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by RyanM View Post
    So what the heck should I do if I were to encounter someone back there? Hold them at gunpoint? I never contemplated a scenario like this before. How would determine if it's just some guy lost (possible but unlikely) or someone up to actual no good?
    What do you want to have happen? Do you want to get involved with the police and possibly the court system? Do you want to get involved in an armed confrontation? Or do you just want the stranger to get out of your yard?

    It sounds like the camera system did its job. Lighting is a great tool — inexpensive solar motion-detecting lights are good warnings, especially when backed up by brighter floods you can switch on.

    I would NOT go out and confront a stranger at close range.

    Something like lights on, phone in hand, “Can I help you?” from a window or door seems like a reasonable first step. If they approach, ask them to stop. If they continue, retreat, lock up and call 911.

    Even if it is just a lost drunk — do you really want to deal with a lost drunk? It can go badly more ways than it can go well.
    Last edited by peterb; 04-01-2019 at 05:49 PM.

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