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Thread: 1st match. AIWB Lim Minor.

  1. #21
    King of Craft Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Sierra View Post
    I know AIWB cultists get all hot and bothered when safety is brought into question, but think hard about the geometry of the two setups that you mention and you will see the answer.
    I don’t know... a properly wedged AIWB holster doesn’t sweep any body parts.
    "BJJ is sort of like nonconsensual yoga"
    "You don’t really graduate from certain problems or certain things… like you always have to work on trigger control and pulling the trigger straight. " --Ben Stoeger 1/24/2018

  2. #22
    Regular guy. Cory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Sierra View Post
    I'm neutral on the issue of AIWB. I don't do it but don't care if others do. Since you're new to USPSA, I'm trying to give you some intel you can use if you need it.

    If help isn't wanted, just let me know.
    It's welcome and appreciated. I've been following USPSA shooters and USPSA in general for a few years, but am new as a shooter. In other words I'm aware of the rules in general, but not able to specifically state their number and verbatim. So I definitely appreciate someone who can.

    I just wanted to give you the heads up that brevity is the sole of wit, but doesn't translate well to text. And being direct is appreciated in person, but appears crass when indirectly communicated. Playing devils advocate or glass half empty eventually wears on folks. Like I said, I do my best to not assume it's personality and instead to take it with benefit of the doubt. I guess it came off wrong. Probably still coming off wrong. That's text for you I guess.


    -Cory

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clusterfrack View Post
    I don’t know... a properly wedged AIWB holster doesn’t sweep any body parts.
    I'll take your word for it cause I ain't looking in there to see for myself.

  4. #24
    Glad you eventually got going, Cory. Match mistakes are growing pains, just keep shooting.


    ID'ing yourself as a new shooter is a very smart thing to do. I wish people realized that and didn't make you score just before your turn to shoot. As far as AIWB, I have always de-emphasized that. Sanctioned match - RO's responsibilities to run it by the rules; ignorance is also a learning opportunity but not an excuse. However, I have almost always reminded, quietly, to an RO who was running a stage that it was coming out of AIWB when starting position was uprange, and the direction I was moving. ROs do get understandably nervous about uprange starts, and unusual holster position can take to another level. When you show them that you care about their safety, people tend to appreciate that, even if factually you're no more dangerous than people who draw from a strong side.

    One more thing that I want to mention. You may have thought this through already, if yes - disregard. USPSA may be the first place, or only place, where you will eventually be required to draw from a seated start. Most cases of AIWB fatalities that I know of were related to handling a loaded gun while seated. Dry fire the hell out of this scenario, even if it is not common. Personally when drawing from appendix seated, I don't put my hand on a gun until I am fully upright.
    “Well," said Pooh, "what I like best," and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called.

  5. #25
    Regular guy. Cory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YVK View Post
    Glad you eventually got going, Cory. Match mistakes are growing pains, just keep shooting.


    ID'ing yourself as a new shooter is a very smart thing to do. I wish people realized that and didn't make you score just before your turn to shoot. As far as AIWB, I have always de-emphasized that. Sanctioned match - RO's responsibilities to run it by the rules; ignorance is also a learning opportunity but not an excuse. However, I have almost always reminded, quietly, to an RO who was running a stage that it was coming out of AIWB when starting position was uprange, and the direction I was moving. ROs do get understandably nervous about uprange starts, and unusual holster position can take to another level. When you show them that you care about their safety, people tend to appreciate that, even if factually you're no more dangerous than people who draw from a strong side.

    One more thing that I want to mention. You may have thought this through already, if yes - disregard. USPSA may be the first place, or only place, where you will eventually be required to draw from a seated start. Most cases of AIWB fatalities that I know of were related to handling a loaded gun while seated. Dry fire the hell out of this scenario, even if it is not common. Personally when drawing from appendix seated, I don't put my hand on a gun until I am fully upright.
    Really appreciate you chiming in! You're a big part of the reason I got my act together with my reholster and slowed it down.

    I hadn't really worked the sitting draw. I may wait until standing to draw if that's an option. Are you ever required to draw and actually fire while seated?

    This isn't something I think of as a strong option for self defense. I feel like seated is where AIWB doing a more slow hidden draw may be a better option. I hadn't thought much about speed. I think i'll look more into this.

    -Cory

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by YVK View Post
    Personally when drawing from appendix seated, I don't put my hand on a gun until I am fully upright.
    That's not a bad idea no matter where your holster is. The danger is very real even when the holster is on the side.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by cor_man257 View Post
    Are you ever required to draw and actually fire while seated?
    Nope. Sitting is a higher risk situation, USPSA doesn't DQ you for sweeping your leg when drawing from sitting but they don't require shooting from sitting.

    More so, and tangential to this discussion a bit, but there are stages where you're sitting and gun is loaded on a table in front of you, with all targets available from that position. A lot of folks pick it up and shoot while remaining seated, thinking that this is faster. I don't know of any good shooter who tested it and found that doing it that way gives better hit factors. Most strong shooters learn how to pick it up and get a grip while getting upright, and then crush it.


    Quote Originally Posted by cor_man257 View Post


    This isn't something I think of as a strong option for self defense. I feel like seated is where AIWB doing a more slow hidden draw may be a better option. I hadn't thought much about speed.

    -Cory
    All I think about with appendix and sitting, USPSA or anything else, is safety.
    “Well," said Pooh, "what I like best," and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called.

  8. #28
    @YVK to confirm you’re saying most of those seated injuries are from the draw portion and not reholstering? Due to them getting on the trigger early while standing and sweeping their legs?

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Sierra View Post
    That's not a bad idea no matter where your holster is. The danger is very real even when the holster is on the side.
    I find that mentally prioritizing standing up and getting a grip correctly gets me to where I am pretty much standing when gun's coming out. There is instructional video of Ben doing a seated start, he is much faster to the gun and with the draw than I am, and he still doesn't get it that far out before he is standing.
    I also get my hand on a gun faster with AIWB than strong side when standing up, function of less hand travel and grip being less of a moving target.

    Quote Originally Posted by scw2 View Post
    @YVK to confirm you’re saying most of those seated injuries are from the draw portion and not reholstering?
    I don't know the details, reholstering, drawing, or adjusting. I think I've heard of three reports, two for sure, where fatal outcome was related to AIWB gun and sitting in a vehicle. I don't differentiate and consider all sitting AIWB manipulations a high risk.
    “Well," said Pooh, "what I like best," and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called.

  10. #30
    Regular guy. Cory's Avatar
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    Posting this here as well... because it seems like this thread is serving as the current AIWB in USPSA thread and this might be food for thought.

    From my journal:
    Made it to another match. It was like an hour and a half drive but I had to go so I could get classified. I tanked a classifier at the last match, and needed another one.

    Nice club. Talked alot with some M class shooters (Single Stack) one of which was the Match Director. Had a great time. Managed to shoot at all the targets this time.

    Strong shooters. I didnt place well, but I'm too new to worry about that at the moment. Results:
    https://practiscore.com/results/card...8-43443ac4481c

    Uspsa.org is showing the classifier but it says that the match activity fee has not been paid. Im wondering if the club is still going to pay because I need this classifier for my initial classification.

    Anyway... you learn a lot on match day.







    -Cory
    -Cory

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