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Thread: Red Dots, "way of the dinosaur"

  1. #21

  2. #22
    Regarding the idea of using a separate magnifier with a red dot; has anyone used the Leupold DEVO? I've looked through one at a range demo but that's about it.

    I like the idea since it doesn't require tipping or swinging anything in place to use. It should also be less obtrusive than a traditional magnifier hanging off to the side in a tip-off mount and much faster to deploy than carrying the magnifier in a pouch or pocket off the rifle. The DEVO sits below the RDS so there shouldn't be any problems with mounts/heights not really lining up and it shouldn't interfere with the stuff that makes the RDS a good carbine optic.

    Down side is cost since the DEVO is priced at $1,200 MSRP. Also, same stuff applies with other magnifiers. It will add weight, stick out one side (all the time in this case) and is not illuminated.

    https://www.leupold.com/scopes/rifle-scopes/d-evo

  3. #23

  4. #24
    Supporting Business NH Shooter's Avatar
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    A magnified optic does not make a rifle any more mechanically precise, but it aids the shooter in placing the shots more accurately.

    So much of today's discussion on "carbine optics" is centered on using a rifle in CQC scenarios, where the RDS is perhaps still the best choice. While that has plenty of relevance to Mil and LE applications, I don't think I could take a run to the local grocery store with an AR slung over my shoulder without causing a stir. In the highly unlikely event I ever have to use a firearm for self-defense (inside the home or out), it is exceedingly likely it will be the pistol I'm carrying concealed. So at least in my mundane world here in Mayberry, NH, "CQC" = pistol.

    On the other hand, the chances are incredibly high that my scoped MSR will be used for some recreational steel-ringing at the range, typically at distances well beyond what are considered practical for a pistol. For me it's all about traditional rifle marksmanship - small targets at long distances, engaged from unsupported field positions - and the low-magnification/etched-reticle optic allows me to enjoy that with my old man eyes.

  5. #25
    S.L.O.W. ASH556's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NH Shooter View Post

    On the other hand, the chances are incredibly high that my scoped MSR will be used for some recreational steel-ringing at the range, typically at distances well beyond what are considered practical for a pistol. For me it's all about traditional rifle marksmanship - small targets at long distances, engaged from unsupported field positions - and the low-magnification/etched-reticle optic allows me to enjoy that with my old man eyes.
    Disclaimer: this may not really be what you meant, but it struck a nerve and I hear it often enough, so here goes:

    Lots of folks (even pro-gun regular shooters) seem to be of the opinion that someone having a quality "fighting" style rifle and training to be proficient with it is based 100% in fantasy and has no value. It seems to me we forget things quickly. It was only 30 years ago that we were concerned about the possibility of Communist invasion on US soil. It was only 75 years ago that we actually did have a military attack on US soil (if you consider US embassy's as US soil, then it gets more recent). From Wiki: "The Office of the Director of Civilian Marksmanship (DCM) was created by the U.S. Congress as part of the 1903 War Department Appropriations Act. The original purpose was to provide civilians an opportunity to learn and practice marksmanship skills so they would be skilled marksmen if later called on to serve in the U.S. military."

    The point is, some of the folks who mock the notion of you training with a kitted-up AR think that shooting CMP stuff with an '03 or Garand is the greatest thing since sliced bread. It's the same thing! You're just using much older hardware. The wording used in the Second Ammendment makes it clear that the founders intent was for every man to be armed and equipped to fight to defend freedom; enlisted service or not. Point being, there is significant value in maintaining a high level of proficiency with arms and not necessarily ONLY those you regularly carry in public.

    /rant.
    Last edited by ASH556; 03-05-2019 at 11:14 AM.
    Food Court Apprentice
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  6. #26
    Supporting Business NH Shooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASH556 View Post
    Point being, there is significant value in maintaining a high level of proficiency with arms and not necessarily ONLY those you regularly carry in public.
    Yes, 100% agreed - whether it's drilling the X-ring at 600 yards or doing A-zone mag dumps at 10.

    Fun (and proficiency with a rifle) somewhere along that continuum can be found by all.

  7. #27
    Site Supporter rob_s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASH556 View Post
    It was only 30 years ago that we were concerned about the possibility of Communist invasion on US soil.
    I don't know that I'd use that particular scare-tactic as a justification for why we need an AR...

    while it may have seemed real at the time, it sure doesn't sound like it ever had any legs. or at least any legs we could have done anything about with a bunch of armed dad-bods. I suppose we could have all gone down to the coast of Florida in '62 and fired our BARs at the incoming missiles...

  8. #28
    S.L.O.W. ASH556's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    I don't know that I'd use that particular scare-tactic as a justification for why we need an AR...

    while it may have seemed real at the time, it sure doesn't sound like it ever had any legs. or at least any legs we could have done anything about with a bunch of armed dad-bods. I suppose we could have all gone down to the coast of Florida in '62 and fired our BARs at the incoming missiles...
    I get what you’re saying. Not every perceived threat is a real threat. Also, 9/10/2001 how many people were in a safety bubble of denial?
    Food Court Apprentice
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  9. #29
    Sometimes it ain't the Commies or the Aloha Snackbars you have to take up arms against. #yeehawd #cowliphate
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  10. #30
    Supporting Business NH Shooter's Avatar
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    Best way to deal with the Communists on U.S. soil today is to simply vote them out of office. :-)

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