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Thread: Green Lasers

  1. #11
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    I would consider the TLR-8 Green laser.

    https://www.streamlight.com/en/produ.../index/tlr-8-g

    I have been very happy carrying the TLR7 on a 19.5/45 in a JMCK AIWB-WC. It’s shocking getting nearly x300 ultra power out of such a small lightweight light. Very well made.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwperry View Post
    So far, everyone is correct about the advantage of green lasers.

    But

    Red lasers are universally known as the "knock it the F off" illuminator. I know we don't train for people to be scared of pumping a shotgun or pointing a gun at them, but psychologically red lasers are effective
    I have actually pointed guns with visible lasers at people, and the one that stands out the most to me was a big biker dude, after a foot pursuit, who could only comment on what a scared little pussy I must have been because I couldn't hold the dot still. You know, like in the movies. Your wobble zone gets much bigger when you just sprinted after a burglar, and the chemical cocktail gets fired up. No one else ever noticed the laser, they were more impressed by the cop that appeared to be ready correct their nutritional deficiency with a copper and lead supplement. @Dagga Boy had an excellent thread on this board a few years back that I participated in that concerned this topic.

    Come to think of it, my Taser has 2 lasers on it, one solid, and one flashing, and I don't recall too many people responding to the laser. Maybe I was too busy at the time to notice, but it seems to me it is a whole package kind of thing. Command Presence, Tactics, Voice Tones. Most people who are involved in an activity that would require tasing or shooting aren't going notice on their body a visual cue that they need knock it off. They tend to be altered (even if only on endogenous chemicals), fired up, pissed off and goal oriented. After carrying a laser on my duty pistol for over 16 years now, and one on my Taser for 12 years I solidly put the visible laser in the same basket as the sound of a shotgun being racked or an AR bolt dropping. Nice when it works. But when it works is definitely the outlier, so rare I cannot bring myself to try to use it.

    I HAVE made a robbery suspect wet his pants with the sound of my AR bolt dropping. It was a happy coincidence. I don't try to use that to gain compliance either.

    just my $.02, and worth exactly what you paid for it.

    pat

  3. #13
    Site Supporter JodyH's Avatar
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    Surefire XH55 is gonna be the hot ticket.
    Mines currently on backorder... supposedly 7 days out.
    Last edited by JodyH; 02-14-2019 at 07:32 AM.
    "For a moment he felt good about this. A moment or two later he felt bad about feeling good about it. Then he felt good about feeling bad about feeling good about it and, satisfied, drove on into the night."
    -- Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy --

  4. #14
    Member Wake27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNM1136 View Post
    I have actually pointed guns with visible lasers at people, and the one that stands out the most to me was a big biker dude, after a foot pursuit, who could only comment on what a scared little pussy I must have been because I couldn't hold the dot still. You know, like in the movies. Your wobble zone gets much bigger when you just sprinted after a burglar, and the chemical cocktail gets fired up. No one else ever noticed the laser, they were more impressed by the cop that appeared to be ready correct their nutritional deficiency with a copper and lead supplement. @Dagga Boy had an excellent thread on this board a few years back that I participated in that concerned this topic.

    Come to think of it, my Taser has 2 lasers on it, one solid, and one flashing, and I don't recall too many people responding to the laser. Maybe I was too busy at the time to notice, but it seems to me it is a whole package kind of thing. Command Presence, Tactics, Voice Tones. Most people who are involved in an activity that would require tasing or shooting aren't going notice on their body a visual cue that they need knock it off. They tend to be altered (even if only on endogenous chemicals), fired up, pissed off and goal oriented. After carrying a laser on my duty pistol for over 16 years now, and one on my Taser for 12 years I solidly put the visible laser in the same basket as the sound of a shotgun being racked or an AR bolt dropping. Nice when it works. But when it works is definitely the outlier, so rare I cannot bring myself to try to use it.

    I HAVE made a robbery suspect wet his pants with the sound of my AR bolt dropping. It was a happy coincidence. I don't try to use that to gain compliance either.

    just my $.02, and worth exactly what you paid for it.

    pat
    The closest I’ve ever come is a marathon target, which while awesome, is definitely not on the same level. That being said - I wonder how going for the face would work. Disrupt their eyes and have the advantage of a solid CNS shot, assuming you can maintain the aim for more than a brief second.


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  5. #15
    Member That Guy's Avatar
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    overseas
    Quote Originally Posted by FranksDad View Post
    The Sub 2K has a Barska, which is surprisingly good given the price.
    Any further details? I am always interested in cheap crap, especially if it actually works.

  6. #16
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    Feb 2019
    I bought it at Cabelas.pretty basic; it does have wndage/elevation adjustment, uses a CR 123 battery, picatinny rail attachment.
    I paid around $150CDN for it. Yes, I’m in Canada, so I would expect your prices to be lower. All told, it’s an excellent value

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wake27 View Post
    The closest I’ve ever come is a marathon target, which while awesome, is definitely not on the same level. That being said - I wonder how going for the face would work. Disrupt their eyes and have the advantage of a solid CNS shot, assuming you can maintain the aim for more than a brief second.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I am sure that there would be an effect, but I doubt I would ever find out if there was. I understand what you are saying , but when I am pointing guns at people there is a rather simple thought process going on. Do I need to shoot? Yes/No, repeat. Every move I make, and my suspect makes, causes me to ask the question and answer it. If it is not a solid, definite YES, then it is a NO and re evaluate immediately. The re evaluation is constant. So If I were setting up a CNS shot, I am more worried about the need to set up and make the shot, than I am anything else. If I observe a change in behavior before the shot breaks, whether the suspect just changes his mind, or is dazzled by my laser I need to respond to the change in behavior, not knowing or caring what caused the change in behavior. Based on my training, when you put your front site on someone (or laser) you need to be ready to destroy them, even if you change your mind a split second later.

    TLG mentioned in class that the average untrained shooter can get off about 4 rounds a second. I think DB and Wayne Dobbs have mentioned that because of the required thought processes going on that .3 to .5 splits are more realistic in many shooting encounters. I agree. Most people can shoot faster than they can observe, decide, and act. At one point my timer beep to first round on target was about .75 seconds, from a secure holster.. But they were all SHOOT targets, with the only decision being when to start. No other processing necessary. In reality, even if you are shooting your opponent to the ground, there is a small OODA loop that needs to happen, because as your suspect gets shot at things change, and the next round in the mag may need to be launched, or it may not. You not only have to decide to shoot, or not, you need to explain that decision.

    If my laser is disrupting my suspect's vision, then he is already well within .5 seconds of a life changing event, and his corresponding change in behavior may not be noticed in time to avert that event.

    Not entirely clear, but hope it helps....it is past my bed time.

    pat

  8. #18
    Member Wake27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNM1136 View Post
    I am sure that there would be an effect, but I doubt I would ever find out if there was. I understand what you are saying , but when I am pointing guns at people there is a rather simple thought process going on. Do I need to shoot? Yes/No, repeat. Every move I make, and my suspect makes, causes me to ask the question and answer it. If it is not a solid, definite YES, then it is a NO and re evaluate immediately. The re evaluation is constant. So If I were setting up a CNS shot, I am more worried about the need to set up and make the shot, than I am anything else. If I observe a change in behavior before the shot breaks, whether the suspect just changes his mind, or is dazzled by my laser I need to respond to the change in behavior, not knowing or caring what caused the change in behavior. Based on my training, when you put your front site on someone (or laser) you need to be ready to destroy them, even if you change your mind a split second later.

    TLG mentioned in class that the average untrained shooter can get off about 4 rounds a second. I think DB and Wayne Dobbs have mentioned that because of the required thought processes going on that .3 to .5 splits are more realistic in many shooting encounters. I agree. Most people can shoot faster than they can observe, decide, and act. At one point my timer beep to first round on target was about .75 seconds, from a secure holster.. But they were all SHOOT targets, with the only decision being when to start. No other processing necessary. In reality, even if you are shooting your opponent to the ground, there is a small OODA loop that needs to happen, because as your suspect gets shot at things change, and the next round in the mag may need to be launched, or it may not. You not only have to decide to shoot, or not, you need to explain that decision.

    If my laser is disrupting my suspect's vision, then he is already well within .5 seconds of a life changing event, and his corresponding change in behavior may not be noticed in time to avert that event.

    Not entirely clear, but hope it helps....it is past my bed time.

    pat
    Yup, all makes perfect sense - good points.

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by UNM1136 View Post
    I am sure that there would be an effect, but I doubt I would ever find out if there was. I understand what you are saying , but when I am pointing guns at people there is a rather simple thought process going on. Do I need to shoot? Yes/No, repeat. Every move I make, and my suspect makes, causes me to ask the question and answer it. If it is not a solid, definite YES, then it is a NO and re evaluate immediately. The re evaluation is constant. So If I were setting up a CNS shot, I am more worried about the need to set up and make the shot, than I am anything else. If I observe a change in behavior before the shot breaks, whether the suspect just changes his mind, or is dazzled by my laser I need to respond to the change in behavior, not knowing or caring what caused the change in behavior. Based on my training, when you put your front site on someone (or laser) you need to be ready to destroy them, even if you change your mind a split second later.

    TLG mentioned in class that the average untrained shooter can get off about 4 rounds a second. I think DB and Wayne Dobbs have mentioned that because of the required thought processes going on that .3 to .5 splits are more realistic in many shooting encounters. I agree. Most people can shoot faster than they can observe, decide, and act. At one point my timer beep to first round on target was about .75 seconds, from a secure holster.. But they were all SHOOT targets, with the only decision being when to start. No other processing necessary. In reality, even if you are shooting your opponent to the ground, there is a small OODA loop that needs to happen, because as your suspect gets shot at things change, and the next round in the mag may need to be launched, or it may not. You not only have to decide to shoot, or not, you need to explain that decision.

    If my laser is disrupting my suspect's vision, then he is already well within .5 seconds of a life changing event, and his corresponding change in behavior may not be noticed in time to avert that event.


    Well said. It corresponds in very close approximation with all of my experience in real-time events.

    I have never counted upon (or even contemplated) any psychological effect during lethal force incidents. (There is not enough time unless you are a comic book character with some type of time-warping super-power.)

  10. #20
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    For whatever it is worth, the recent workplace shooter in Illinois used a green laser. Some of his former co-workers fled when they saw the green dot.



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    Any legal information I may post is general information, and is not legal advice. Such information may or may not apply to your specific situation. I am not your attorney unless an attorney-client relationship is separately and privately established.

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