The one bolt override I ever had to deal with, less than a year before retiring, I didn't even consider mortaring because the frigging firing line was full of REMFs, and my range safeties were a bunch of warrant officer pilots. That was the range I kicked my company commander off of...Originally Posted by TGS
/noshitthereiwas
/digression
Recovering Gun Store Commando. My Blog: The Clue Meter
“It doesn’t matter what the problem is, the solution is always for us to give the government more money and power, while we eat less meat.”
Glenn Reynolds
That's exactly why I dig Mike Pannone's method. Works like a charm, no tools needed, no risk of damage to your weapon. My own personal anecdote, despite only having one optic break on me during my time of service I still don't like to slam shit around knowing that one, electronic shit breaks and two, zero's can shift and I prefer to be able to hit what I am aiming at. Obviously the urgency of a situation can dictate methods but save the extreme for the most dire of circumstances. It bears repeating no matter how bomb proof your weapon/optic combo is it can still break and then you are SOL. Just because you can abuse something doesn't mean you should.
That must've been back in the day when NCO's were allowed to do their job and it wasn't a risk of loosing your career over doing the right thing, (not like I ever GAF). Nowadays they'd probably NJP your butt or court-martial you for booting the CO, too many ninnies who get their feelings hurt these days.
Well, I was sort-of respectful about it...
This was in '99, BTW, and I had never been trained to deal with a bolt override.
Recovering Gun Store Commando. My Blog: The Clue Meter
“It doesn’t matter what the problem is, the solution is always for us to give the government more money and power, while we eat less meat.”
Glenn Reynolds
Bolt over base is what I have heard that called as in bolt over the base of the cartridge.
That happens when the cartridge is jammed up between the bolt and the charging handle because the charging handle was in the forward position while the bolt was cycling rearward and the mag vomited a round straight up at just the right moment (heck if I know why) for the now forward traveling bolt to get the base of the cartridge wedged between the charging handle "stem" and the bolt.
Usually yanking on the charging handle makes it worse by jamming the case harder above the bolt and wedging the whole mess in tight.
The fix Panone shows at 1:30 in this video that Mike C linked is similar to what I've seen work the easiest.
Use your finger, stick, blade or other suitable object in the ejection port or magwell to press the bolt to the rear. That takes the tension off the case and lets it fall out from above the bolt. If you made the mistake of operating the charging handle and jamming the case in harder it'll take more force to push the bolt back and free the case. In that situation doing like Panone shows and whacking the charging handle forward while pushing backwards on the bolt will do the trick.
In either case expect it to take some effort to get the bolt moving initially.
Unfortunately that mistake is generally part of the TTP of immediate action (tap, rack, bang, or whatever), prior to going to the remedial action.
I’m also not a fan of the mortaring method. I vastly prefer the Mike Pannone method. I’ve only had this happen to me once during live fire. At the time I had not seen Pannone’s method and I mortared the rifle. I cleared the malfunction but snapped the USGI buttstock. Since learning Pannone’s method I haven’t encountered a brass over bolt malfunction in live fire but I have set it up several times to practice or share the clearing method with others. It’s simple, required no tools, and doesn’t risk damaging the gun.
I also send people this video of Pannone explaining the malfunction and the clearance procedure if they haven’t seen the malfunction before: https://youtu.be/jCXwoK28Oj8
I like it a little better than the previously linked video because it’s filmed closer up.
My posts only represent my personal opinion and do not necessarily reflect the opinions or official policies of any employer, past or present. Obvious spelling errors are likely the result of an iPhone keyboard.
FWIW, there's no need to be slamming the rifle hard when mortaring to clear a bolt override. I don't know why people do this....I'm not sure where it came from, but I see youtube videos of people going ape shit on the ground with their gun when mortaring as if they're trying to kill a commie.
You shouldn't be applying enough force to break the stock, and you shouldn't be applying the force to the toe to begin with. If you've got any quality stock other than a legacy mil-spec M4 stock, it's even less of a concern. It's really more of a sharp tap, as if you're trying to crack a walnut with the stock but not send the pieces flying everywhere and completely destroy your snack.
We practice this in our classes as work. The pool rifles at the training center (with legacy mil-spec M4 stocks) get this done to them multiple times a month, pretty much every month out of the year. They're not breaking stocks left and right.
ETA: Mortaring will also work effectively regardless of how hot your bolt is. I highly doubt anyone is going to hold a direct impingement bolt to the rear using their fingertip after a few mag dumps, which is our most likely scenario for long gun use.
Last edited by TGS; 12-07-2018 at 09:18 AM.
"Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer
true, but those videos may also be someone trying to clear a stuck case, which *can* require repeated and pretty hard strikes.
Yeah, I can't personally see sticking a finger in there, but I suppose if someone is shooting at me, and I'm using my carbine to defend myself, and I don't have a pistol, and can't run away and hide somewhere... no yeah I can't see using a finger.ETA: Mortaring will also work effectively regardless of how hot your bolt is. I highly doubt anyone is going to hold a direct impingement bolt to the rear using their fingertip after a few mag dumps, which is our most likely scenario for long gun use.
I kept first a Strider knife on my chest rig (when I was trying to be cool) and later a Leatherman and just used those.
I separated the pad of my trigger finger sticking it in the breach of an auto shotgun. It was a fucking bloodbath. Fortunately, I still have some feeling in my trigger finger.
I DO NOT RECOMMEND STICKING YOUR FINGER IN THE BREACH OF A GUN.
Last edited by Clusterfrack; 12-07-2018 at 12:12 PM.
“There is no growth in the comfort zone.”--Jocko Willink
"You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
This is why I was willing to pay big bucks for the Leatherman MUT tool, which has a hook specifically for dealing with a bolt override on an M16/M4/AR15, and is the only specialized multi-tool I can conceive of owning. (Being neither EOD nor a medic.)
Recovering Gun Store Commando. My Blog: The Clue Meter
“It doesn’t matter what the problem is, the solution is always for us to give the government more money and power, while we eat less meat.”
Glenn Reynolds
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