Various drills and standards seem to be readily available for pistolcraft, but what about so-called "practical rifle"? Do you have a dry fire routine?
I'm particularly interested in what someone like @GJM would expect for off-hand performance and at what distance with a .308 or 300 Win Mag class bolt gun.
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
- William Pitt the Younger
Rifles (AR-15 types and such) are simply far easier to wield well than pistols. You are better off devoting your time to master the pistol.
That said, a few drills are very good.
The Half and Half Drill is very good.
The 1 - 5 Drill is very good.
These may both be from Kyle Lamb.
I really suck at off hand rifle, in part because I am relatively tall, thin and flexible, and part because I have spent relatively little time working on it. I am happy to hit my eight inch steel off hand at 100, so I guess that would translate into 24-30 inches at 300. I have made some memorable off hand snap shots on game, but that is quite different from what I think you are asking about. There was a guy in my carbine class at Gunsite who shot as well off hand at 300 as he could from a position, but he was as wide as he was tall, and practiced it all the time. Stiff boots, laced tight help me off hand.Originally Posted by 1911nerd
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
That's good feedback and I probably do spend more time with a pistol, however I tend to enjoy shooting rifles more. The genesis of the question was a recent hunt and trying to get a sense of what I should expect out of each position (off hand, squatting, with shooting sticks, prone).
Well at least I don't feel so bad, then. Not sure I can blame it on body build here, but I probably have very similar body type. I clearly have work to do off hand, but 8" at 100 yards is doable for me; starts to fall apart at 200+ yards, though. With a good rest and good conditions, I was getting first round hits on steel at a lasered 540 yards last week with the new Tikka T3 300 Win Mag.
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
- William Pitt the Younger
Very brief follow-up (because I don't want my poor communications skills to misrepresent me):
We may be talking about two different things. The two drills that I listed were for semi automatic carbines. Dry fire routines are largely redundant if you dry fire with your handguns. Dry practicing reloads would probably be a better use of time with carbines.
You said
....308 or 300 Win Mag class bolt gun
My advice above may not really be very applicable. I've conducted a battle rifle course of fire before - and have some lessons learned from that - but it's certainly not bolt guns.
I believe Randy Cain offers training on precisely what you are inquiring about... @rob_s may know more about this.
Sorry for the ramble.
IMO getting into one of Randy’s Practical Rifle classes is the place to start. Standards or drills are great, but if you’re approaching them with bad fundamentals then I’m not sure you’re not just reinforcing bad habits and chasing a standard you may never meet.
Just a bit more discussion on the carbine side:
I've found that most of the common carbine drills focus WAAAY too much on running the carbine fast at pistol distances. Sure, multiple hits on multiple targets at close distance super duper fast isn't a bad thing, but it's definitely not the only thing. Bill Blowers (Taprack Tactical) has some drills involving offhand @ 25yds with time and accuracy constraint that are somewhat challenging. Defoor's carbine tests also.
Carbine manipulations are really what choke most guys up and that's all stuff you can practice dry:
-Reloading
-Getting into and out of positions
-Offside transitions
-Doublefeed clearing
"Conventional Wisdom" says a carbine bolt lock reload should be around 2 sec to be really fast. I have video of a friend doing it in 1.30. @karmapolice was there as a witness as well.
Sorting out your gear layout is important because there are more interface points. Optic position, stock position, grip angle, light position, sling position. I've found in several cases that a setup worked and was good to go...until I tried to do ________________ with it.
Food Court Apprentice
Semper Paratus certified AR15 armorer
I've been through Randy's class -- not sure when I'll be able to do it again, but it is definitely on the list. Also went through Gunsite 270, although it has been a long time.
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
- William Pitt the Younger
A lot of it depends on what you want to do, but The Art of the Rifle (https://www.amazon.com/Art-Rifle-Jef.../dp/1581605927) has the drills, tests, and standards that you need. Some of them are related at http://www.frfrogspad.com/courses.htm.
Also, while the mechanics of offhand and standing differ, the real difference is speed. Offhand is fast and good for moving targets; standing is slower and best for stationary targets. You’d shoot offhand at a deer sneaking away from you through cover 40 yards away, but standing at the same deer at the same distance if it were unaware of you and you just needed to see over something to get a hit.
Dry fire is definitely your friend. With a bolt-action rifle, focus on running the bolt hard with the butt in your shoulder, using a sling, and getting in to position quickly. Cooper covers all of this in his book, and you can do all of them in dry fire.
As others have mentioned, shooting a handgun will give you a huge leg up with trigger control. If you're planning a hunt where you expect to shoot offhand, then confirm your zero six months out, spend a month or so shooting from different positions, and spend the last 3 months shooting offhand. Start at 50 yards and work out to 100. I rarely practice offhand beyond 100 yards--at those ranges, I have time to get in to a sling and shoot more carefully. Also, while all shooting skills are perishable, offhand seems to be the first to go. If you're solid on your fundamentals but your time is limited, then focus on offhand.
Finally, I shoot a lot of offhand because nearly all of my shots hunting require it. I’ve taken several deer, eight feral cattle, a couple of hogs, and a Roosevelt elk that way. If you can hold 8” at 100 yards offhand (not standing), then you’ll be deadly on game.
Six inches would be better, though.
Okie John
“The reliability of the 30-06 on most of the world’s non-dangerous game is so well established as to be beyond intelligent dispute.” Finn Aagaard
"Don't fuck with it" seems to prevent the vast majority of reported issues." BehindBlueI's
100% agree. When I first started getting into ARs, about 10 years ago I’d shoot rifle maybe 4 times a year if I was lucky, but I spent a ton of time on dry fire/manipulations. Contrast that to now where I throw rifle work into pistol work typically once a week on the range.
Between the two, I don’t think there’s much benefit to regular live fire, if you haven’t gotten the rest of the puzzle knocked out from dry fire.
The nice thing, is that a lot of what needs to be worked out with carbines can at least be simulated dry. Throw your rifle rig on and start working positional shooting in your kitchen with the chairs, barricades with your island, reloads in the living room. Figure out what your reload looks like when slick vs armor vs bag vs gamer setup.
I thought I had my rifle and most of my kit how I wanted it. I thought this whole variable scope thing was dialed in and gtg. Until I tried it with a pro-mask last night, then the “Red dot like speed” of the variable went out the window.
Rant summary: dry fire every scenario, test your gear, then confirm with live fire.
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