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Thread: P30 accuracy issues?

  1. #1
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    P30 accuracy issues?

    I've been struggling for the last few months to get decent groups out of my P30. I got it in December, and it's never been tight. For a while, I blamed myself, but then I took some instruction (used the instructor's guns that day) and discovered that I actually could shoot accurately... but when I tried it at the range I couldn't replicate that success. I tried switching ammo a few times (Remington UMC, S&B, Magtech, Independence), slowing down, swapped the sights, painted the sights, but my groups are still awful.

    Today, I took it to the range, and put it up against two other guns, using the exact same ammunition, exact same range.

    For the first one, I shot 5 rounds from each one, then 10 rounds from each one. For the second, I did 15 rounds straight through (one gun only has a 13 round mag so it was 13 then 2). The range for all three guns on each target was the same, since I just left the target out there and didn't move it in between each gun. The range is about 5 yards. I was NOT shooting for speed, I was shooting methodically, taking my time to line up shots, resetting grip as needed, but not lowering my hands or shuffling my feet. The ammunition was 9mm Independence 124 gr (had to buy it at the range since I was renting one of their guns for the test).

    Here are the results:

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    Gun 1 is the P30, that I take to the range at least once a week and get 50 - 100 rounds through per trip, and dry fire multiple times per week. 5" groups.

    Gun 2 is a Glock 17, rented from the range. I've only touched a Glock once before in my life, (other than holding them at gun stores) and that time I only put one mag through it. I am sure that this gun's been shot to death and it certainly doesn't have any modifications to it to improve accuracy.

    Gun 3 is a Jericho Compact (Baby Desert Eagle Compact). I've shot this gun twice before (first time was just 6 rounds, second time was 2 or 3 magazines). Stock 3 dot sights, no modifications to it, etc.

    What this test shows me is that I am *not* an awful shot, but I seem to shoot the P30 pretty badly, at least in comparison to the Jericho Compact.

    So... is this "acceptable accuracy" from a P30? If not, should I be concerned? Should I send it to H&K? Take it to a gunsmith or armorer? Get a different gun to continue to practice with, and step up to the P30 when I am a better shooter? Is there something I might be doing wrong?

    As a relatively inexperienced shooter, it is very tough for me to improve when I can't see to get the bullets on target, but at the same time, I'd not be so thrilled about committing to a platform like the Jericho that is based on a design with reliability concerned and has a total lack of aftermarket stuff.

    J.Ja
    Owner/President of Titanium Crowbar, LLC

  2. #2
    Member orionz06's Avatar
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    I believe that is you and not the gun.

    I also believe accuracy issues with other guns is beginning to get into the heads of everyone else. Glocks on average are 3" guns at 25, let's assume the P30 will meet that. Assuming that is linear you should have a paster sized group at 5 yards. Even the bad M&P's I have seen will shoot a paster sized group at that range.

    Here is my problematic M&P at 3 yards:


    Here is another M&P that is problematic (now) shot at 25 yards standing, ignore the knife please. The paster to the right was shot with a .22 at 10-15 and the group above it was also at 10-15.


    Brand new USP 9c that I bought with a student loan check, because smart, and shot the first 10 rounds at 25 at the store I bought it at.
    Last edited by orionz06; 02-25-2012 at 02:33 PM.
    Think for yourself. Question authority.

  3. #3
    Dot Driver Kyle Reese's Avatar
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    What variant of the P30 are you shooting? DA/SA or LEM?

    I would have an experienced handgun shooter shoot it for groups and see if the issues can be replicated before contacting HK.

    Some other things off the top of my head....

    - Is there any damage to the barrel crown? Have you dropped your P30 in it's muzzle onto a hard surface?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by FredM View Post
    What variant of the P30 are you shooting? DA/SA or LEM?

    I would have an experienced handgun shooter shoot it for groups and see if the issues can be replicated before contacting HK.

    Some other things off the top of my head....

    - Is there any damage to the barrel crown? Have you dropped your P30 in it's muzzle onto a hard surface?
    It's a DA/SA, all shots were done in SA for all guns, just to make it consistent.

    Having another shooter take a gander at it is definitely in line, I was going to ask the guys at the range to give it a go but they were slammed today.

    The P30's never been dropped, mishandled, etc. and the crown looks good, no marks and it's even. Other than a friend shooting a few mags through it, I'm the only one who has handled it.

    J.Ja
    Owner/President of Titanium Crowbar, LLC

  5. #5
    Member orionz06's Avatar
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    Shoot from a sandbag if possible.

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...SX1PZQBKSTTFBQ

    I rest my hands on something solid to level the sights.
    Think for yourself. Question authority.

  6. #6
    Member SecondsCount's Avatar
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    My experience with three P30's is that they are very accurate handguns, typical groups are a ragged hole at 21 feet (7 yards) during slow fire.

    I suggest trying to benchrest the gun and see if the groups improve before going any further.
    -Seconds Count. Misses Don't-

  7. #7
    Member JHC's Avatar
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    OP - nothing to worry about IMO. Groups at 5 yards are only indicative of the shooters trigger press. And you have better luck with a pure single action trigger which is quite normal. Glock push to the left is quite normal. I had a Colt 1911 that shot soccer ball sized groups at 25 yards from a rest. But at 20' I once put 20 shots into one "rathole" because my trigger press was good. I sold the gun. You'll be good to go. Keep at it.
    “Remember, being healthy is basically just dying as slowly as possible,” Ricky Gervais

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by orionz06 View Post
    I believe that is you and not the gun.
    Any idea what I might be doing wrong? Also, why would I be outshooting it by a mile with a different gun? I will say that the recoil on the Jericho is a LOT less than the P30 because of that heavy steel frame, do you think I might be reacting to the recoil or anticipating the shot? I swapped the grip panels and backstraps out for the larger ones to give myself more room to get my hands on it, and because with the smaller backstrap, my support thumb was getting bit by the rails. Perhaps I made it too big for my hands to control?

    I certainly don't expect great grouping or anything like that... not at my skill/experience level, but the difference between the guns is remarkable.

    I'll try it from a sandbag as you suggest. I can't sit at the range, but I can kneel. A few weeks ago, I did that with just the P30 (no sandbag, but rested my arm on the shelf), and the groups did tighten up a bit.

    J.Ja
    Owner/President of Titanium Crowbar, LLC

  9. #9
    Member JHC's Avatar
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    The greater the ratio between the weight of the trigger pull and the weight of the gun the easier it is to shoot accurately. The Jericho groups should not surprise and would be true of almost any new shooter.
    “Remember, being healthy is basically just dying as slowly as possible,” Ricky Gervais

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by JHC View Post
    The greater the ratio between the weight of the trigger pull and the weight of the gun the easier it is to shoot accurately. The Jericho groups should not surprise and would be true of almost any new shooter.
    That makes perfect sense. I knew that the heavier gun would bring me back on target quicker, but I didn't realize that the heavier gun also improves accuracy on slow shots too.

    Thanks for clearing that mystery up!

    Sounds like I need to work with an experienced shooter or instructor to see where my mistakes are being made and how to correct them.

    Thanks!

    J.Ja
    Owner/President of Titanium Crowbar, LLC

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