What about it? It's legal here for CCW or active LEO. But I can't say I find the idea appealing for more than one reason.Originally Posted by Sidheshooter
What about it? It's legal here for CCW or active LEO. But I can't say I find the idea appealing for more than one reason.
Last edited by blues; 11-12-2018 at 05:48 PM.
There's nothing civil about this war.
I don’t frequent bars, but I DO go to restaurants in my neighborhood and area that have delicious food. I love me some chicken wings and roasted Brussels sprouts.
I don’t drink at all. For years. I carry 24/7 per department policy AND I also have a CCW. I’m always the designated driver/designated defender. I don’t mind it, and I’m glad everyone can have a good time, as safely as possible.
This is tangential, and was cited by Greg in his article, from the DEAN, Mas Ayoob:
https://www.backwoodshome.com/blogs/...ted-defenders/
Last edited by Sherman A. House DDS; 11-12-2018 at 05:57 PM.
Illegal here.
I find it (legal CCW) appealing because large amounts of musical/artistic and political culture events go on in drinking establishments that promote the arts and "think and drink" type events. I’m not talking meat markets where people go to frottage with their clothes on, or choke out bouncers, or whatever; rather: wine bars and craft breweries where people see fine music, fine art, and raise money for various charities, and panel-discuss the fine points of internet privacy in the new millennium. If I’m out of the house at night, I’m either at the gym, or enjoying/working at one of those events.
But my original point being: there were reportedly 6 cops onsite, and the bad dude reportedly stopped shooting long enough to post to social media. Even a j-frame might have helped out in that instance, and "that instance" could be any number of places in any number of cities on any given night. Even the goofball meat marketeers deserve self-defense. That’s why I bring it up.
Last edited by Totem Polar; 11-12-2018 at 06:14 PM.
”But in the end all of these ideas just manufacture new criminals when the problem isn't a lack of criminals.” -JRB
I don't drink at all so it's moot to me but the statute says "under the influence" but it doesn't define "under the influence". I'd be afraid to touch a drop under those circumstances but I have carried in a bar
@Sidheshooter
Potentially it can be an advantage under circumstances you or Mas bring up if one elects to be a designated driver / defender.
At least the option is legal here to carry if not imbibing.
I might have some concerns about being the guinea pig in a court case where being labeled the "designated defender" is interpreted as demonstrating a propensity for seeking an armed encounter.
Also wonder how it would be perceived by the outfits that many of us have secured policies with to provide legal assistance in the event of a self-defense shooting.
Simply offered as food for thought.
There's nothing civil about this war.
Good points.
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Not illegal here, nor against department policy. Our policy is a wordy version of "if you've had any detectable amount of alcohol, you can only use your police authority (including use of your firearm) if it means ending a literal life threatening emergency to you or someone else, and you'll turn it over to on duty officers as soon as possible."
I don't go to bars. I don't drink more than a single drink in an outing, and rarely that any longer. Out of state on LEOSA, not even a single drink. Seems to have worked so far.
Sorta around sometimes for some of your shitty mod needs.
In VT it’s not against the law to carry into a bar and, as far as I can tell, it’s even legal to drink while you do so. I believe the standard to carry a gun should be the same as the standard to drive a car: drank too much to drive? You should not be armed at the time. I tend not to drink in public. I prefer to drink at home and even there I rarely drink to the point of intoxication. If I’m out with my girlfriend and friends, I’m normally the designated driver. I won’t have more than one drink with my dinner when out and about. Oftentimes I won’t even have the one.
I think that laws that automatically criminalize carrying guns into bars are wrong and misguided. The line should be drawn at some level of alcohol consumption. I’m okay with that line being no alcohol consumption at all as long as the act of carrying the gun into a bar isn’t a crime in and of itself. This is the second large scale active shooting in a bar/club recently that I can recall (the other one being Pulse). In both of those incidents it was illegal for patrons to be armed on premises. I guarantee you not everyone present was drunk or planning to drink. It’s possible that if carrying into the establishment wasn’t prohibited, someone could have stopped both of those shooters before the body counts reached what they did.
My posts only represent my personal opinion and do not necessarily reflect the opinions or official policies of any employer, past or present. Obvious spelling errors are likely the result of an iPhone keyboard.
I have never, ever enjoyed consuming alcohol, so for me it is easy. When I am in anyplace where alcohol is being served, I just request a Coke. Sometimes the bartender assumes, without asking, that I am a designated driver and refuses my offer of payment.
I have, on rare occasions, had a single glass of champagne at a wedding reception, but that is my limit while carrying. I wouldn't necessarily have a problem with someone having 2 or fewer drinks while carrying, but respectfully submit that having zero is the wisest choice.
Does anyone really want to have alcohol on their breath after an incident requiring the gun to be employed?
Does anyone want to face a situation involving not only an active shooter but numerous innocents running across the line of fire while trying to neutralize that active shooter, while even slightly impaired? That situation would be a challenge for many sober shooters.
My dad, a former general practice attorney with a substantial criminal practice (both prosecution and defense at various times), once described an incident in which an armed robber walked into a bar/liquor store and pulled a knife. That bar happened to be popular with off duty police, all of whom immediately drew their guns. That robber was easily taken into custody after uttering a profanity and dropping his knife. So, I understand why police or anyone else would want to be armed while in a bar. I will never understand why they or anyone else needs to consume alcohol.
That used to be Connecticut until 2016
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