10-Round 9mm Pistol

[Larry Sellers]

Not a bad choice, personally curious about the reliability of the 10 round mags for the compact and full size 9mm guns.

I just figured out that the full-size variants of the P250 and P320 in .45 ACP are 10 rounds standard. I'm not a big fan of the 320, but a smooth, light DAO trigger in a polymer frame that points like a Sig with California-legal mags full of .45 might not totally suck.

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[Galbraith]

I just figured out that the full-size variants of the P250 and P320 in .45 ACP are 10 rounds standard. I'm not a big fan of the 320, but a smooth, light DAO trigger in a polymer frame that points like a Sig with California-legal mags full of .45 might not totally suck.

My agency started switched over to P320s last year from classic DA/SA Sigs. I ran the full sized P320 9mm version for about a year after their adoption, and before that I ran a mix of 9mm/40/45 DA/SA classic Sigs for about 15 years. The P320s have run surprisingly well for us. I recently decided to take a gamble and buy a full sized P320 in .45acp simply because I have found that I have always favored the caliber. I found that I not only shot the P320fs in .45acp better than I shot Sig P220 .45s, but I tended to outshoot my P320fs in 9mm. Sure, the .45 version does not have the capacity of the 9mm, and my splits are "slightly" faster in 9mm, but my overall accuracy was superior in .45 at all ranges double and single handed. Recoil is quite mild with its beefy slide, and flat recoil spring. At least in the full sized P320, it's .45acp for me. I have a little over 2000 round through the .45 without a single hiccup of any kind, and gun still feels and looks new. 2000 rounds through a P220 would have greatly weakened the recoil spring and showed some decent wear on the internals. I haven't tried the carry or compact models in .45acp, so I can't help you there.

[Bigghoss]

I just figured out that the full-size variants of the P250 and P320 in .45 ACP are 10 rounds standard. I'm not a big fan of the 320, but a smooth, light DAO trigger in a polymer frame that points like a Sig with California-legal mags full of .45 might not totally suck.

In that case, don't forget the M&P45. Lots of LEO trade-ins floating around.


I have some neutered 10-round PX4 and M&P9 mags I need to try out. I had been kicking around the idea of visiting a friend in L.A. and taking my fullsize PX4's as travel guns. And the M&P9 2.0 I got off GB came from CA with 10-rounders. I bought a Ruger P95 about a week after the AWB expired so it came with 10-rounders that never gave me any trouble.

[OlongJohnson]

I had an SD9VE that I sent down the road after S&W sent me replacements for stock parts that were defective. The striker was bent like a banana so the firing pin always hit the inside of the slide before it ever had a chance to get to a primer. The recoil spring guide rod assembly self-disassembled while it was sitting on my work bench. Found the part that flew the farthest in a corner of the garage when I moved stuff months later. I couldn't get the trigger reasonably smooth, and the reason was the crappy machining of the striker block plunger bore in the slide. I knocked the high spots out of it, but ultimately, there was nothing that could be done without making it cost what 1911s cost. Not exactly the same as the M&P action, but it increased my reluctance to mess with any current-production S&W stuff.

I like the P250 a heck of a lot better. I currently have two (.22LR and .380) that have surprised me with how nice they are and how well I shoot them.

[Tom Duffy]

Yea it would be nice to believe ex post facto would prevent confiscation or destruction, but NY Safe Act theatrics seem to indicate contrary.


I wouldn’t expect a 10-round limit though. I look for all future bans to mirror NY Safe and go for 7 or fewer rounds and as strict enforcement of that as possible.

Currently, New York state has a 10 round limit. My understanding is that the original SAFE Act has been eroded over time in the Federal courts. I don't know of any state that currently has a less than 10 round limit and I don't think that is going to happen anywhere.

[M2CattleCo]

All y'all fantasizing about complying with new and exciting gun laws are seemingly glossing over the fact that self defense in most any capacity becomes illegal or near impossible to be considered justified in the eyes of the law that won't let you have a whole handful of ammo in your pistol.

It's ridiculous that anyone would entertain complying with these types of restrictions.

[spinmove_]

All y'all fantasizing about complying with new and exciting gun laws are seemingly glossing over the fact that self defense in most any capacity becomes illegal or near impossible to be considered justified in the eyes of the law that won't let you have a whole handful of ammo in your pistol.

It's ridiculous that anyone would entertain complying with these types of restrictions.

And yet here we are with consistently eroding gun rights and many of the general population are either happy to give them away or simply can’t be bothered to oppose it.


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[okie john]

All y'all fantasizing about complying with new and exciting gun laws are seemingly glossing over the fact that self defense in most any capacity becomes illegal or near impossible to be considered justified in the eyes of the law that won't let you have a whole handful of ammo in your pistol.

It's ridiculous that anyone would entertain complying with these types of restrictions.

I’m in a world of hurt if I end up in court, but that goes with the problem of self defense. I also figure that this set of events is likely to be very rare. I’m far more concerned about other contact with law enforcement, say if a traffic stop turns into the LEO deciding that he or she needs to search me. THAT could be a trip to jail and a shitload of other complications, some of which may be felonies.


Okie John

[spinmove_]

I’m in a world of hurt if I end up in court, but that goes with the problem of self defense. I also figure that this set of events is likely to be very rare. I’m far more concerned about other contact with law enforcement, say if a traffic stop turns into the LEO deciding that he or she needs to search me. THAT could be a trip to jail and a shitload of other complications, some of which may be felonies.


Okie John

Pretty much this. If I’m about to go full-on “Wolverines!” I’m most likely not doing that with 10-round magazines. I’ll save my standard capacity mags for that rainy day. But routine traffic stop gone wrong? Well, you know what they day about those broken taillights. Don’t give’em a reason to slap you with anything.


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[Galbraith]

As far as how many rounds do you need in your gun goes, Jeff Cooper once said "how often do you miss?" The correlation between wasted shots and rounds in the gun is a noticeable trend in law enforcement as we have transitioned from wheel guns to high capacity semiautos which also have the luxury of letting you know when the gun is empty. There is indeed a psychological link between how many rounds you "think" you have to play with, and how quickly you deplete that ammo, aimed shots or not(more often, "not"). Many officers waste full magazines trying to skip rounds off pavement, or shoot through concealment or cover with virtually no effect. These techniques very rarely pay off, and are hardly ever worth the waste of ammo. If you are a scholar of OISs, you will often find that most field officers only hit meat around 25% of the time, and most of those are not vital hits. In fact, the FBI 9mm Justification(The Liability Mitigation Document) stated that officers miss around 70-80% of the time. However, you're looking at a very wide array of field personnel with varying skill and athletic ability. Once you narrow the criteria to SWAT officers, or officers with advanced firearms training or competition experience the hit ration is the exact opposition with about a 75% hit rate. Practice, and skill trump magazine capacity every time. I am perfectly comfortable using a 10+1 .45 in a wonder 9 world.

When it comes to gun law, best practice is to obey the law. When it comes to using deadly force for self defense, you better have every aspect of your case as clean as possible. If you won't do it for yourself, do it for your family. These things end up hammering families financially and emotionally for many years.