Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 45

Thread: California Bar Shooting

  1. #1
    Member Sal Picante's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    SunCoast

    California Bar Shooting

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ed/1927903002/

    The first reports of shots fired came around 11:20 p.m. Wednesday. Early eyewitness accounts suggested that the shooter, who may have dressed in all black with a large trench coat, threw a smoke grenade into the bar before opening fire first on an employee at the door and then on random people. Dean said some people inside the bar broke windows to escape gunfire, and hid inside restrooms and attics. Shots were still being fired when officers arrived on the scene. Officers said about 30 shots had been fired.

    A law enforcement official told The Associated Press the suspect was 29 years old, armed with a .45-caliber handgun. The official declined to provide any other details, speaking on condition of anonymity for lack of authorization to publicly discuss the investigation.

  2. #2
    Member Sal Picante's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    SunCoast
    Sorry for posting - didn't realize there was already a thread about it.
    "Shooting in the news" https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post808331

  3. #3
    Hammertime
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Desert Southwest
    Quote Originally Posted by Les Pepperoni View Post
    Sorry for posting - didn't realize there was already a thread about it.
    "Shooting in the news" https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post808331
    No apologies needed. Mass shootings usually get their own thread.

  4. #4
    I was skimming an article and they mentioned there is surveillance video available. One thing that stood out to me is they said an officer arrived on scene and took up an armed position outside the bar, instead of entering and engaging which I understand is the recommended course of action to stop the murderer.

  5. #5
    Site Supporter
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    ABQ, NM
    Quote Originally Posted by scw2 View Post
    I was skimming an article and they mentioned there is surveillance video available. One thing that stood out to me is they said an officer arrived on scene and took up an armed position outside the bar, instead of entering and engaging which I understand is the recommended course of action to stop the murderer.
    Cowards will always be cowards when the chips fall - doctrine, TTP's, good ideas, or saving lives be damned.
    Sadly, many folks don't know they're cowards until the chips fall, and right up until that moment they talk the talk. Not unlike the FL school murders.

    Edit: The more I read on this, the less conclusive it is that one of the LEO's responding posted up and waited instead of going in to engage. Regardless of the LE response, I'm getting awful weary of this particular dance.

    -Assholes gonna asshole
    -Inexplicably soft target due to regional laws/hoplophobia
    -Soft target attacked
    -LE can only react, casualties are inevitable
    -OMG ITS THE GUNS AND CRAZIES WITH GUNS

    It's especially heartbreaking to see the perpetrator is a former Marine. I wish like hell that he'd reached out to some of his fellow vets and told them he was in a dark place, and gotten the help he needed.

    An old drinking buddy of mine, E5 type from the NM ANG, killed himself in his truck on Halloween barely a week ago.
    An NCO I serve with currently who's a veteran of the initial invasion of Iraq and is easily one of the most experienced and squared away guys we have, almost succeeded in killing himself a few weeks ago but an unexpected visit from his ex-wife stopped him and she made him vomit up all the pills and whiskey he'd used to wash them down.

    I don't have an easy fix - but it's pretty clear there's a problem is in post-service care.
    Last edited by JRB; 11-08-2018 at 10:33 AM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by scw2 View Post
    I was skimming an article and they mentioned there is surveillance video available. One thing that stood out to me is they said an officer arrived on scene and took up an armed position outside the bar, instead of entering and engaging which I understand is the recommended course of action to stop the murderer.
    Quote Originally Posted by JRB View Post
    Cowards will always be cowards when the chips fall - doctrine, TTP's, good ideas, or saving lives be damned.
    Sadly, many folks don't know they're cowards until the chips fall, and right up until that moment they talk the talk. Not unlike the FL school murders.
    According to Fox News:

    Helus, a veteran of 29 years, arrived first on the scene and immediately entered the bar with two California Highway Patrol officers after hearing gunfire. But as they made their way inside, Helus was shot several times. The patrolmen pulled the sergeant from the line of fire, and Helus was taken to a local hospital, where he was pronounced dead early Thursday.
    Doesn’t sound like a coward to me.

  7. #7
    Site Supporter
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    ABQ, NM
    Quote Originally Posted by TC215 View Post
    Doesn’t sound like a coward to me.
    Certainly not - and I'm sorry that I dared insinuate otherwise. I edited my post accordingly.

  8. #8
    Member TGS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Back in northern Virginia
    Quote Originally Posted by scw2 View Post
    I was skimming an article and they mentioned there is surveillance video available. One thing that stood out to me is they said an officer arrived on scene and took up an armed position outside the bar, instead of entering and engaging which I understand is the recommended course of action to stop the murderer.
    Not sure about the department's in question, but some places have TTPs to wait for a backup officer and go as a team of two. My best friend's department had a rule to wait for 3 and go in as a team of 4. ETA: They had an awesome chief and were fairly pro-training as well....their patrol rifle course was a week long, for instance, instead of a just a fam-fire like many departments. I say that only to point out that it wasn't a policy developed out of incompetence/ignorance to developing TTPs.

    While the general theme nationwide has shifted from containment/wait for SWAT to a proactive response by available LEOs, there's different organizations with different recommendations and ways to do things as far as individual officer response vs forming ad-hoc teams.
    Last edited by TGS; 11-08-2018 at 10:39 AM.
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  9. #9
    banana republican blues's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Blue Ridge Mtns
    Quote Originally Posted by TC215 View Post
    Doesn’t sound like a coward to me.
    Amen. No one who goes through a door into harm's way should ever be thought of us as such.

    (And I know JRB didn't mean it to come across that way.)
    There's nothing civil about this war.

    Read: Harrison Bergeron

  10. #10
    Site Supporter
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    ABQ, NM
    Quote Originally Posted by blues View Post
    (And I know JRB didn't mean it to come across that way.)
    I certainly did not, and I deeply regret posting first and reading more later.
    I have the deepest respect for anyone that charges into harms way regardless of the uniform they wear.

    But I remember being a teenager and screaming at the TV as SWAT officers gathered outside Columbine HS and did nothing. The Parkland FL murdering spree only reignited that frustration, and emotional responses are often the wrong ones - like my initial response here.

    RIP, Sergeant Helus

User Tag List

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •