The Golden Age begins.....

[Dagga Boy]

I was in deep thought last night when I couldn’t sleep. I had an LTT Beretta next to the bed that I have been using as a dry practice gun because it’s trigger and controls exactly match my LTT Elite. I was thinking “where was this thing all these years”. I thought about the glorious Colt 1911 pistol. It was in military service for 60 plus years before it got the attention it deserved and the early 70’s brought about 30 years of incredible development in parts, modifications and the training and shooting improvements that all occurred together. The Glock and Beretta are in the same place now. 30 plus years and we are really seeing huge improvements in parts, modifications, and the training and development that have moved along with it. Like the Colt 1911, the Glock has hatched a bunch of similar styled striker fired service pistols. The Beretta has kind of done the same where the DA/SA Guns are concerned.

Like the 1911, I think many companies are going through ups and downs in production quality and QC/QA and of course a roller coaster of customer service between eras. Now that the Sig is replacing the Beretta in military service like the Beretta replaces the Colt, we are seeing some great development of an unrestrained system that has the foundation of military demanded QC/QA.

Overall, it’s a neat time, and I am having a pretty good time diving into a brave new world. I am seeing what it must of been like for a guy who carried a 1911 for decades as an issue gun and retiring and seeing what Swenson, Pachmayer, Kings, Clark and many others were doing with those guns, while watching Leatham, Enos, and others run the crap out of them.......meanwhile, kind of watching these companies trying to figure it out...something Colt made an art of screwing up the transition.

[MattyD380]

This is really cool thinking. "Past is prologue," as they say.

Interesting that this "golden age" is multi-faceted: Striker & DA/SA. While I suppose DA/SA really began as an outgrowth of the emerging expertise around the 1911, it's now finding a renewed sense of maturity, juxtaposed to striker-fired guns. I think the internet has been a boon to gun culture 2.0, so to speak; the exchange of ideas, and the consumer voice probably has more influence on the industry than ever before.

And, as you said, I hope military-mandated QC translates to better products all around. And personally, I'd like to see DA/SA continue regain ground, and drive further innovation/product differentiation.

[Craig@SSD]

Couldn't agree more @Dagga Boy. It's a great time to be a gun enthusiast. Innovation is prevalent throughout the industry, and viable options are at an all-time high.

[okie john]

SNIP…meanwhile, kind of watching these companies trying to figure it out...SNIP

The “figuring it out” piece is huge.

During the Golden Age of the 1911, gun rags were a way for the manufacturers to get a message out to the public, but if a member of the public wanted to respond, he had to write a letter to the editor, snail mail it, and hope that someone at the magazine didn’t think that it threatened ad dollars from the gun makers. With luck, it might get a response months later. Jeff Cooper was somewhat of an antidote to that, but he did at least as much as the gun rags to stifle innovation even as he claimed to promote it.

The democratic flow of information made possible by forums like this one (and a very few others) will be the biggest drivers of innovation as we move forward. The most important thing they have done has been to shift the focus from hardware to software and tactics. As a result, guys who really understand this stuff (Ernest Langdon, Pat McNamara, Larry Vickers, DocGKR, Pat Rogers, John Hearne, Cecil Burch, Tom Givens, Wayne Dobbs, and yes, Dagga Boy) can lead the thinking and discussions rather than being confined to being local experts.

Definitely interesting times.


Okie John

[BillSWPA]

I agree that the Internet has been critical. When my Dad began carrying a gun in the 1980’s, his holster choices were limited to whatever the local gun stores carried. If he was lucky, that meant Bianchi, but some of his holsters were Triple K. It was not easy to find the good stuff unl we one knew where to request a catalog.

Kydex holsters were not even available. IWB carry generally meant soft leather with a belt clip. Good subcompact guns also did not exist. The best one could hope for was a small frame .38 or a .380 that is bigger than some 9mm’s we have today. If something smaller was needed, the options were .22 and .25 caliber.

I stopped reading the gun magazines a long time ago. The only thing I bother reading now is a very small number of forums with a small number of knowledgeable participants.




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[Mark D]

DB makes a good point. Of course Glock has had a ton of aftermarket support for a while. But it's very cool to see that trend expanding to other platforms.

I've just dipped my toe into the Beretta world, and I'm been amazed at the level of support. It's awesome to have really high quality components and service from folks like Ernest Langdon and Wilson Combat, but even the factory has gotten in the game. Want different levers? Tons of choices. Want a different trigger spring? Options abound. Want a whole new trigger? No problem!

I'm loving it.

[Trooper224]

I've been living with the Beretta 92 for a bit over four years now. Coming to the 92 from the 1911 world where nearly everything except the grips screws need fitting, I've been very happy with the ease of maintenance and simply the overall lack of issues with the 92. When the 92 was replaced I suspected there would be something of a resurgence for the design, just like we saw with the 1911. Once the company was no longer relying on a government contract, or being hamstrung by one depending on your point of view, I suspected we'd see an increase in commercial focus on the type. The nostalgia factor also can't be denied. A lot of those guys who hated the 1911 with a passion when we used it in the service later became fans due to the desire to reconnect with the good old days.


Having grown up in an era wherein gun magazines and gunshops were the main sources of information and when choices in serious defensive handguns were far more limited, I can say with one hundred percent certainty that we're experiencing an embarrassment of riches in the gun world. Finding a good gun used to be the obstacle, now it's narrowing the field and making a choice.

[okie john]

It's awesome to have really high quality components and service from folks like Ernest Langdon and Wilson Combat, but even the factory has gotten in the game.

I hope that this becomes the way of the future. Having a range of factory original upgrades available might kill a few small companies, but it would be heavenly for users.


Okie John

[JonInWA]

When viewed strictly from it's technical specifications and operational guidance processes, the Beretta 92 seems to be a bit of a dark horse for the resurgence its currently undergoing. It's comprised of a myriad of parts, some of them requiring relatively complex manufacturing techniques, is somewhat large (particularly for a 9mm platform), and is fairly lubrication intensive.

The reality is that the Beretta 92 is superbly designed, and in production has been the beneficiary of an exceptionally high quality of both materials, manufacturing processes, and quality control. And it's a joy to shoot, providing shooters with excellent input as the trigger is manipulated in all of it's various action alternatives.

And. lately, the lily has been significantly gilded by the attentions and improvements lavished on it by Ernest Langdon and Bill Wilson, with the collaborative relationship they've developed with Beretta (it's been nice to see Erik Stern from BUSA participating here). There efforts, improvements, and thoughts on technique making the most out of the platform's capabilities have been exceptionally transformative. Thanks to them, Beretta 92 owners can enhance their pistols both in terms of technique and component improvements, and can do so in one (or two) fell swoops (either by purchasing a LTT 92 or a Wilson Combat 92) or incrementally (by purchasing high quality individual or grouped component sets from Beretta, Wilson, and/or LTT, and Wolff-and others (particularly pertaining to available grip and sight options).

I've personally been the recipient of the largess of those discussed when it comes to equipping and running my personal Beretta, a 92D, which I've enjoyed documenting and discussing my 92 journey here on p-f.

The internet, and the quality of informed internet discussion (particularly on p-f, which has had a gratifyingly high level of both participant quality and discussion quality throughout its existence to date) has truly been a paradigm changer. And we're significantly seeing it here and now with the Beretta 92. Manufacturers, designers, gunsmiths, and users (at multiple levels) can achieve near instantaneous, and interactive collaborative feedback and discussion, which can result in fairly nimble manufacturing changes and market placements.

We are in a golden age. And it's been a pleasure to participate in.

Best, Jon

[Dagga Boy]

So....when you lay awake at night thinking about Beretta’s and the Golden Age if 80’s Guns...

Shot a Langdon warm up into four holes followed by a 300 HiTS Super Test with a Ernest Langdon tuned 92 G with an Elite barrel. I think based on the commentary and my own thoughts, the Beretta 92 is coming into its own 1911 age. Great for customization, not at Glock Level disposable and plug and play with parts. Mastering the de cocker to sub conscious is like getting the 1911 safety to sub conscious. I doubt we will see the 1911 level of popularity, but it will be a gun many “served with” and is capable of being built and customized to a great level.