Keith's heavy .38

[okie john]

Very nice. I think for all around that would have it all over an actual SWC since that meplat is pretty legit.

It looks a lot like the long flat-nose (LFN) designs that Veral Smith of LBT used to champion. Terminal performance should be better than that of an SWC, but it can be easier to make the SWC shoot well. A lot of Veral's designs shoot best at high velocity and don't shoot as well when they're going slow.


Okie John

[TiroFijo]

It looks a lot like the long flat-nose (LFN) designs that Veral Smith of LBT used to champion. Terminal performance should be better than that of an SWC, but it can be easier to make the SWC shoot well. A lot of Veral's designs shoot best at high velocity and don't shoot as well when they're going slow.


Okie John

I've tried them from 800 to 1100 fps, in 38 spl and 357 mag cases, and the accuracy in my guns was excellent. VERY tight groups at 25 m, and they are still accurate at 100-200 m.

[revchuck38]

I loaded some .38-44 loads from an old Lyman manual with six grains of Unique under a 170 grain LSWC. I've shot it but haven't chronographed it, am going to the range Thursday morning to do just that (and shoot some other stuff). My calibrated thump-o-meter says 1050-1100 fps, we'll see what the chrono says. I shot it in my M13, it's too much thump for me in a K frame. I'll probably use my 681.

I made it to the range today but was time-crunched and the sky wasn't cooperating. I managed to get a five-round string and it showed 1077 fps and 17 SD from my 4" 681. That's a PF of 183, not too shabby from a .38 Special...but the only .38 I have that I'd think about shooting them in is my Official Police, and probably not then. I loaded them for my 4" M28-2.

Looks like my thump-o-meter is still within calibration limits.

[03RN]

This isn't about a reload but I really dig this thread cause some day I'll return to reloading and those heavy .38 loads are cool.


But, here's a +P 158 grain flatpoint from the reputable Lawman line. It just came back "in stock".

https://www.sgammo.com/product/38-sp...tmj-ammo-53750


Cheap too.

They also have a standard pressure .38 swc from ppu rated at 900fps.

[OlongJohnson]

The Speer has a $2/box rebate going from Vista.

[willie]

Elmer wrote me - G&A Q&A, not personal correspondence- that the .358477 was OK if I just must use Magnum brass, but he still preferred 358429 in Special brass.

Elmer preferred .38 Spl brass for this bullet because its length sometimes caused problems when seated in magnum brass. In these instances, the bullet had to be seated deep enough to permit crimping on the front edge of the shoulder. The arrangement reduced powder capacity. His favorite load was this bullet and 8 grains of Unique in a .38 Spl case. He was shooting it in .38/.44 revolvers. These were N frames but at the time the N designation did not exist. My favorite .38 Spl bullet is the 477 150 grain version. I fired untold 1000s in Spl cases loaded with 5.5 grains of Unique. I ran these through K and J frames without incident. However, today's reloading philosophy is that it is over pressure and should not be used. The 477 bullet and 5 grains of Unique is a much better balanced load. Accuracy is superb, and pressures are sensible.

[boatbum101]

I've loaded & shot 38-44 loads with the Keith designed 358429 for many years . I usually shoot them from a pre Model 23 ODM or a Model 28 . ODM is still chambered for 38 special & of course the 28 is a 357 . The shorter cylinders on the N frames make it necessary to crimp over the front driving band as this bullet has only 1 crimp groove , in 38 special crimp at the groove . The 358156GC which IIRC is a Sharpe design & has 2 crimp grooves lower for 38 cases & upper for 357 cases . My alloy is 12 BHN for both & I use either White Label Carnuba Red or LBT Blue lube . I also use Starline 38 + P cases so these do not wind up in my 38 special Colt OMM or K38 . For many years my favorite powder for this type loads was IMR SR4756 sadly discontinued . I used 7.0grs with the 358429 , 8,0grs with the 358156 . With 2400 I prefer 12.5grs with the 358429 & 13.5grs with the 358156 both are in the 1250fps range from my guns . Other loads that work well with the Keith bullet are 12.5grs 4227 , WSPM primer in 38 case runs 1150fps from the pre 23 6.5" barrel . 2400 loads I use the Fed 100 primer . 8.5grs of VVN-105 w/ Fed 100 , 10.5grs VVN-110 w/ WSPM , 13.5grs W296 w/ WSPM , 7.5grs 800X w / Fed 100 runs 1223fps from my ODM 6.5" . These loads are over SAAMI pressures for 38 + P & I would NOT shoot them in a K or an L frame . N frame S&W , Colt NS or SAA , Ruger guns only . Although I've killed deer , hogs , coyotes with these loads I'll no longer hunt with them . I much prefer my 41mag RBH for that . They do a bang up job on pests eradication regardless of how many legs they have .

[03RN]

I don't think I'm pushing anything even close to Max. I just loaded up some .38s with 158 swc over 4.6 and 5 grains unique. Plus some .357s with the same bullet over 6.4 of unique.

I'd like to find a real good .38 service style load. I've got 2k peices of perfecta brass I'd like to load up for general use/rainy days.

[revchuck38]

I'd like to find a real good .38 service style load. I've got 2k peices of perfecta brass I'd like to load up for general use/rainy days.

What velocity are you looking for? Bullets - lead, plated, jacketed?

[Alpha Sierra]

I'd like to find a real good .38 service style load. I've got 2k peices of perfecta brass I'd like to load up for general use/rainy days.

4.5 grains of CFE-Pistol under anything 158 grains