CZ P09 ignition problems

[Clusterfrack]

Canted hammer: How much play do you have in the roll axis of your hammer? When I thumb back the hammer on both of my P-07s, I can push them hard to right or left and there is very little play. Have you verified that there is significant friction between the hammer and the frame when the hammer spring is removed?

The moment arm on the base of the hammer from the one-sided trigger bar is very small. I don't think that's causing significant torque.

Tolerance stacking: Failures can occur when the the sum of allowable variation in parts dimensions is exceeded. Robust designs often allow for greater tolerances of individual parts. I think this is part of what makes Glocks and the P-07/09 so reliable, and 1911/2011's so unreliable. But, it's also what makes type A, OCD people modify their guns to try to turn their "roughly made" guns into something they're not engineered to be.

[Clusterfrack]

Gun fires when decocker is held down.

On my stock P-07, and my CGW Prograde P-07 (kit installed by me, no bending of trigger bar spring, and no polishing): no matter which way I press the trigger, in DA or SA, the hammer falls normally.

When I hold down the decocker by 10-15 degrees, and press the trigger, the hammer drops forcefully. I will confirm with live ammo later this week.

I agree with @GJM that CZs can be enthusiast's guns, and can be modified to be comparable to the best guns out there at any price. I am totally happy with my Shadow2s, which are relatively lightly modified (a few springs and pins). But the P-07/09 are great guns unmodified. These guns have a very simple and robust design--like a TDA Glock. You probably wouldn't choose a stock Glock or P-07/09 to compete at the highest level in USPSA. But as a defense/duty gun, I have confidence in both.

[Clusterfrack]

Sorry, the post above wasn't clear. I was referring to @GJM's post in the P-07 thread about concerns that the decocker could prevent the gun from firing. After testing today, I do not think this is a concern.

Gun fires when decocker is held down.

[holmes168]

Sorry, the post above wasn't clear. I was referring to @GJM's post in the P-07 thread about concerns that the decocker could prevent the gun from firing. After testing today, I do not think this is a concern.

I tried my P07 out and got the same result. Tried PX4CC and it also fired.

[spinmove_]

So here’s a couple pictures of my P-07. The hammer is indeed canting a bit to the right. Should I be concerned?






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[Clusterfrack]

Hold the trigger down and move the hammer up and down Can you feel any significant friction?

It looks normal to me.

[GJM]

I just hung up with Scott at Cajun — absolutely love him as he is so consistently honest and helpful. Discussed the ignition issue I have been having when pressing the trigger with some side deflection, and he was absolutely aware of it. He first became aware of it when a gunsmith called after his customer was having the same problem. Scott was able to confirm it on his personal gun, and then checked five stock pistols in their inventory, and three of the five did the same thing. He said it is a characteristic of the Omega lock work. He also said if you fire the gun sideways, gangster style, it won’t fire as the disconnector comes off a part.

[Clusterfrack]

Well, that’s not good. I would find that unacceptable and would not carry a gun that did not fire depending on how I hold it or pull the trigger. I apologize to @TicTacticalTimmy for my pedantic response to his tolerance stacking post. You appear to be right about that.

However, neither of my P-07s exhibit these issues.

Do any of us have either of these problems in unmodified guns?
@GJM does Scott have a fix for these issues?

I just hung up with Scott at Cajun — absolutely love him as he is so consistently honest and helpful. Discussed the ignition issue I have been having when pressing the trigger with some side deflection, and he was absolutely aware of it. He first became aware of it when a gunsmith called after his customer was having the same problem. Scott was able to confirm it on his personal gun, and then checked five stock pistols in their inventory, and three of the five did the same thing. He said it is a characteristic of the Omega lock work. He also said if you fire the gun sideways, gangster style, it won’t fire as the disconnector comes off a part.

[ralph]

I just hung up with Scott at Cajun — absolutely love him as he is so consistently honest and helpful. Discussed the ignition issue I have been having when pressing the trigger with some side deflection, and he was absolutely aware of it. He first became aware of it when a gunsmith called after his customer was having the same problem. Scott was able to confirm it on his personal gun, and then checked five stock pistols in their inventory, and three of the five did the same thing. He said it is a characteristic of the Omega lock work. He also said if you fire the gun sideways, gangster style, it won’t fire as the disconnector comes off a part.

Is'nt the disconnector connected to the hammer? So what he's saying is that if the pistol is turned sideways, the dissconnector comes off the hammer, or possibly the trigger bar itself, as that's what it hooks on to,(I don't see how) and the gun won't fire? Am I understanding you right? If I misunderstood you, could you clairfy this a bit, because the more I think about it, the more this dosen't make sense..

[spinmove_]

Uh, what?! Won’t fire while holding it sideways? I mean, I’m not practicing my one handed shooting “gangster style”, but if I need to shoot from a compromised position that may be putting the pistol sideways, that’s a problem.

This almost sounds like a symptom of a modified trigger bar spring. Please confirm if that’s the case.

Next time I hit the range I’ll confirm if sideways shooting presents a problem at all in function. Mine is still bone stock apart from sights, a quick field strip cleaning, and generous lubing.


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