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Thread: USPSA popper calibration rules suck.

  1. #1
    Member olstyn's Avatar
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    Sep 2014
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    USPSA popper calibration rules suck.

    On the last stage of a match today, I got screwed by a popper. We were painting after every shooter, so I know without question that the visible hits were mine. All 3 were within the calibration zone, and the popper didn't fall until the third hit. (Not a forward falling popper, so I was most definitely not "shooting it back up," and all the other steel I shot today fell on the first hit, even some hit below the calibration zone, so I'm confident my ammo was not the issue.) Apparently because I kept shooting until it fell, I couldn't call for calibration, and thus couldn't get a reshoot. I think that sucks. Can anybody give me a logical explanation of why this type of thing is not considered to be a range equipment malfunction?

    Arguably, after having been hit by *any* shots, a popper is not in the same state it started in. Given that, I feel like if either the competitor's ammo has been chronoed and found to make 125+ PF (or no chrono is used at the match, and therefore all ammo has to be assumed to make declared PF), it would make the most sense in scenarios like mine today to recalibrate the steel in question and give the competitor a reshoot regardless of the calibration result.

    All that said, I may be missing some important factor, and I'm definitely salty about it, so if somebody's got a good reason for why the rules are the way they are, I'm all ears.

  2. #2
    Deadeye Dick Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    You got popperfucked. It sucks, but until the rules change it will keep happening.

    The idea that poppers somehow test “power” of the ammo needs to be retired.

    I’m with Ben Stoeger in hoping that USPSA will finally treat poppers like any other steel target. If you hit it in the scoring area with a full diameter hit and it doesn’t fall, it’s a malfunction and you get a reshoot. Why is this not obvious by now?
    "You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
    Shabbat shalom, motherf***ers! --Mordechai Jefferson Carver

  3. #3
    Member GuanoLoco's Avatar
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    The USPSA motto, popularized by Jeff Cooper, DVC stands for the latin “Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas” which translates to “accuracy, power, speed” – the basis of practical shooting.

    Unfortunately Cooper didn’t forsee the 9mm winning the pistol caliber battles, and USPSA is too stubborn to change.

    dVc
    Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Doodie Project?

  4. #4
    Member olstyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuanoLoco View Post
    The USPSA motto, popularized by Jeff Cooper, DVC stands for the latin “Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas” which translates to “accuracy, power, speed” – the basis of practical shooting.

    Unfortunately Cooper didn’t forsee the 9mm winning the pistol caliber battles, and USPSA is too stubborn to change.

    dVc
    Yeah, I know the motto. Clearly I should be shooting 230 gr .45 in Production instead of 124 gr 9mm, at least according to the late great Colonel.

  5. #5
    Member Zincwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clusterfrack View Post
    You got popperfucked. It sucks, but until the rules change it will keep happening.

    The idea that poppers somehow test “power” of the ammo needs to be retired.

    I’m with Ben Stoeger in hoping that USPSA will finally treat poppers like any other steel target. If you hit it in the scoring area with a full diameter hit and it doesn’t fall, it’s a malfunction and you get a reshoot. Why is this not obvious by now?
    Or count it as being hit.

  6. #6
    Member olstyn's Avatar
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    Hah, just looked at the scores on Practiscore, and it appears that stage got thrown out for some reason. There was some controversy about what it was legal to do, start positions, etc, based on both the physical layout and the stage description, so I have a feeling that different squads may have evaluated it very differently. The design intent was clear, but the language of the stage description was not explicit enough, and the physical layout should have had 2 more fault lines than it did in order to make the description work within the rules.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zincwarrior View Post
    Or count it as being hit.
    Honestly that’s my thinking. It’s just a different shaped piece of steel. You can OBVIOUSLY see where it was hit. As long as the hit was on the calibration circle, who gives a crap if it falls or not? The shooter did their job, the popper not doing it’s job is not the fault of the shooter.


    Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

  8. #8
    Pretty easy to answer. Not meaning to be a dick here, but the popper fell and you got credit for the target. So what was supposed to happen?

    What level match was this? Around my parts we don't paint steel at level 1 matches. Level 2 or 3 always get painted between shooters.

    I do agree with you that it's definitely a flawed ruleset. Ben Stoeger's idea is much more realistic and would make matches run smoother too.

  9. #9
    Site Supporter
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    Oct 2013
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    When I was competing - we all got bit by a popper or other form of target/prop malfunction at some time or another. I never to shot to make a living but for fun - so I just accepted it was my day for a prop malfunction and went on.

  10. #10
    Unless it's really windy I try and set poppers as light as they possibly can be without falling over. As your squad is resetting steel they should be checking to see that poppers are light and adjusting as needed. You can still get bit once in awhile by a popper with a mechanical issue, but there is no rule that a popper has to be set to remain standing at some power factor.

    At majors the RO's may or may not object to the competitors adjusting poppers, but if you are resetting and a popper is not falling over to a finger tap I'd mention it them and see if they or you can adjust.

    The way cables hang can cause a lot of activator issues.

    A lot of popperf'ing is the result of your squadmates, not the rules or the RO's.

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