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Thread: Skateboard tape and draw speed

  1. #41
    Member JHC's Avatar
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    Feb 2011
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    North Georgia
    Quote Originally Posted by GJM View Post
    I think the G4/5 surface treatment is perfect, and wish all my pistols had it. Can you discern a difference in your draw between your Gen 4 pistols bare, and the taped up Gen 3?

    It isn’t so much the .10-.15 delta with tape that bothers me, but the increased chance of a really bad grip, that can screw up a whole bunch of shots.
    Your question has been answered to my satisfaction and learning has occurred.

    I shot D1 to a an IDPA target striving for my max speed with a taped Gen 3 G17, a RTF2 G17 and a Gen 4 G22. Ten repetitions each.

    I did not have a the hot hand I had last weekend but I was running D1s in the range of 1.02 to 1.20.

    One factor the same across all 3 guns was vision. At this speed all I'm seeing is a blurry slide on the target with some blurry front sight reference. Not really my style at all.

    But it became clear to me that the Gen 4 with no tape (and no back strap FWIW) was superior for me.

    Taped Gen 3 - only four alphas and the rest charlies (if I 'm generous and call upper alphas charlies ). And some of those charlies were "bad" Cs. WAY out of of the alpha. Three were really bad grips and all three really bad grips put the shot in the upper alpha. Nice looking hits if I was aiming for it.

    RTF2 - only 2 alphas. Two deltas. And again the C's were often bad Cs way out. Just terrible. Several badly fouled grips. This surprised me a great deal.

    Gen 4 G22 - 5 alphas and the balance Cs and they were all "good" close charlies, most in the high chest just above the A zone.. And not one badly fouled grip. My mechanics were similar but I do think with the Gen 4 texture my grip slipped into an acceptable grip at the draw.

    So damn, this was eye opening.

    Attachment 27414
    Last edited by JHC; 06-24-2018 at 03:29 PM.
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  2. #42
    Deadeye Dick Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    Jun 2013
    Location
    Wokelandia

    Skateboard tape and draw speed

    Sorry--I'm late to this party. I just shot two USPSA matches back to back.

    Yes, as @nwhpfan said, I do know a bit about tribology, but I'm not sure I can use much from that field to add anything to what has already been said.

    It seems like there are two main requirements: #1: manipulate the gun to draw and form an ideal shooting grip, #2: maintain the grip and manage recoil. These are in conflict because dextrous manipulation can require sliding, and maintaining the grip prevents sliding. Because we can't (at least at this point) make the grip sticky like duck tape, we have to rely on friction and opposing gripping forces to accomplish #2.

    Humans scale grip forces by estimating the friction coefficient between the digits and the grasped object: the smoother the surface, the larger the applied grip force. That suggests that when gun grips are rougher, they feel "better" in terms of our ability to grasp them. The reality is that if we are gripping really hard, it may not matter that much in terms of #2, but your hands will probably get tired a lot quicker. I find that unless my hands are sweaty and the gun is very slippery, I can crush hard enough to shoot fast and control recoil even if the gun has a smooth grip. But like @GJM, I very much prefer a good rough grip surface high up and on the rear of the left grip. My match guns have very aggressive G10 Lok grips.

    For carry guns, I like rubbery Talon type grip tape because I can slide my hand during the draw, and to form the grip, but they give me enough friction to control recoil without maxing out my hand strength. Interestingly, sticky polymers bend the laws of conventional friction by increasing the contact fraction and adding adhesive forces. That means you get more friction for less grip force.

    Match gun:




    Carry gun:
    Last edited by Clusterfrack; 06-24-2018 at 03:50 PM.
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  3. #43
    Member
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    Oct 2014
    Location
    Savannah, GA
    I'm late to this party as well. I also agree that too much skate tape is no bueno for making micro adjustments to your grip on the draw or after a reload. I have skate tape on the side panels of my competition guns, none on the backstrap, and just two small strips on the front strap. I find this to be a good balance between grip friction and ability to adjust if I don't have a perfect grip.

    I have also tried a few different types of grip spray/gel and find that some of them (e.g. liquid grip) is so sticky that it has the same effect as too much grip tape. I've recently gone to using just weight lifting chalk, which gives me a decent grip on the sandpaper but is still slick enough to adjust for a bad grip.

  4. #44
    Member
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    Sep 2015
    Location
    Alabama
    I took some ideas from here and changed the tape around. That little piece on the upper support side is a game changer during today's dry fire.

    No idea why the picture has rose petals floating around

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  5. #45
    Site Supporter miller_man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Nashville
    Another late comer.

    I added granular talon grips to my P-series CZ's and instantly realized it was too grippy and really jammed up my draw - even from an open competition holster (not to mention shredding my skin in areas that usually slide into place). Having too much grip in the wrong places is just as game changing (in a bad way) as it is game changing having it in the right places.

    I ended up taking another piece of sandpaper and knocking the grit down a good bit, also really sanded down smoother the areas I needed less grip - mostly the front strap and upper half of the side panels. I have it where I really like it - really easy to slide into the perfect grip but also feels locked in when handling/shooting. I think it would be useful if talon and other company's offered their granular grips in varied grits but I'm happy with my solution so far.
    The stupidity of some people never ceases to amaze me.

    Humbly improving with CZ's.

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