Amateur Radio

[mtnbkr]

I get that the amateur radio market is small, but ham radio technology seems like it's at least 10 years behind modern standards. I don't think it's too much to ask for:

-Bluetooth interface with an iPhone/Android app that gives full control of the device
-Cloud service for storing device information
-High quality displays appropriate for the cost of the devices
-Standard user interface across the entire product line
-Regular and easy firmware updates
-Ability to search for and automatically enter info for nearby repeaters using GPS (using the app).
-Automatic RepeaterBook frequency entry, with automatic offset & code

And that's just what I though up in 5 minutes after a cup of coffee. What other modern features would you like in your transceivers?

What @Wheeler said.

What's your use case for having your radio integrated with your phone? I'm assuming you mean your HT, so I'm not seeing how that would be useful.
Same for cloud storage. Unless you're going to build network (wifi or cell) access into the radio, you're going to need a computer, so why not just store the config file there. They're pretty small, it's not like backing up your phone.

The problem with being automatically able to search for and enter repeaters based on GPS is that with repeaters being mostly privately owned, their existence is not always a sure thing. Someone would have to maintain that database. One can use Chirp to access RepeaterBook and essentially copy/paste repeater configs into your radio's config, so no need to manually enter them. You do have to do that before going to the field though.

For myself and my specific use cases specific to HTs...
-Consistent interfaces. I don't care about menus, but can we use some basic conventions? Can we at least get consistency within a manufacturer? The menu on my buddy's FT-60 is completely different than that on my VX-7r. They're both from the same manufacturer!
-A single-band HT with a GOOD receiver (sensitivity, ability to reject adjacent signals or out-of-band signals). None of the current FM HTs have a good receiver aside from the Yaesu FT-60. Because they all have to receive broadcast FM and every discarded public service band known to man, every damn one suffers from overload in metro areas or near rural broadcast towers.
-Standardization of charging ports and do away with requirements to use charging bases. Either 12v standard input or even USB-C PD if I'm able to dream.

In the portable HF arena, I've got everything I want in an Elecraft KX2. Damn thing makes portable operation feel like cheating.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

None of the companies are willing to acknowledge a standard that has been branded by a competitor.

That's why we have DMR, DSTar, and Fusion instead of a single standard.

Finding any support for my Yaesu FT-897 is either extremely expensive or non existent.

What are you looking for? There are several independent shops that could work on your radio. One thing hams are good at is keeping older radios running.

Finding gear that is actually capable of sustained field use without some form of climate control is very expensive or there’s a a robust marketing campaign with no product.

What does "sustained field use" mean? People like to claim the Elecraft KX2 is too delicate and not good for that sort of thing, but I still manage to take it camping, hiking, and biking.
There have been a few good entrances into the portable market this year, but COVID has delayed widespread rollout (Lab599 for example). I saw the Icom 705 at HRO the other day. It's a nice radio, but too chunky for my needs.

Chris

[Clusterfrack]

A few more thoughts. It's interesting that so many Hams don't find current radios wanting in features. I feel like I'm using the radio equivalent of an 8-track tape player. Here are a few of my needs:

I want to be able to travel and have local repeaters appear in my HT and mobile.

When I buy a new radio, I want it to be easy to update my frequencies. RepeaterBook is updated reasonably often, and is a good starting point.

Each frequency should be easy to find, based on its location and other parameters.

A good example of device-app integration are the Garmin InReach devices.

Chirp is an awful piece of software that would have been awful in 1990, let alone 2021. RT works better but is hardly a modern application. And what is up with all the proprietary cables?

I want to be able to program my radios in the field (and while traveling).

Agree about consistent interfaces. An app would make it easy to access every feature on a radio.

What @Wheeler said.

What's your use case for having your radio integrated with your phone? I'm assuming you mean your HT, so I'm not seeing how that would be useful.
Same for cloud storage. Unless you're going to build network (wifi or cell) access into the radio, you're going to need a computer, so why not just store the config file there. They're pretty small, it's not like backing up your phone.

The problem with being automatically able to search for and enter repeaters based on GPS is that with repeaters being mostly privately owned, their existence is not always a sure thing. Someone would have to maintain that database. One can use Chirp to access RepeaterBook and essentially copy/paste repeater configs into your radio's config, so no need to manually enter them. You do have to do that before going to the field though.

For myself and my specific use cases specific to HTs...
-Consistent interfaces. I don't care about menus, but can we use some basic conventions? Can we at least get consistency within a manufacturer? The menu on my buddy's FT-60 is completely different than that on my VX-7r. They're both from the same manufacturer!
-A single-band HT with a GOOD receiver (sensitivity, ability to reject adjacent signals or out-of-band signals). None of the current FM HTs have a good receiver aside from the Yaesu FT-60. Because they all have to receive broadcast FM and every discarded public service band known to man, every damn one suffers from overload in metro areas or near rural broadcast towers.
-Standardization of charging ports and do away with requirements to use charging bases. Either 12v standard input or even USB-C PD if I'm able to dream.

In the portable HF arena, I've got everything I want in an Elecraft KX2. Damn thing makes portable operation feel like cheating.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

It's interesting that so many Hams don't find current radios wanting in features.

For me, it's about having a better radio. I want fewer features and better performance in the core device. I do silly things like stand on mountain tops and talk to people 30-60 miles away. A radio that sings and dances but can't manage that is of no use to *me*.

I want to be able to travel and have local repeaters appear in my HT and mobile.

When I buy a new radio, I want it to be easy to update my frequencies. RepeaterBook is updated reasonably often, and is a good starting point.
Each frequency should be easy to find, based on its location and other parameters.[/quote]
As in magically appear as you move into range of a new repeater? Would it retain the old repeaters or remove them as you moved out of range? What dictated that range? There are repeaters I can reach from close to 100 miles away, especially if I'm on a mountain top, and others I can't touch more than 20 miles away.

Chirp is an awful piece of software that would have been awful in 1990, let alone 2021. RT works better but is hardly a modern application. And what is up with all the proprietary cables?

I agree it's awful, but it's so much better than what came before. Agree completely on the cables. I have 4 radios and 3 cables. I don't have 4 cables because one of those radios is dead simple and used for simplex only, so don't need to program anything.

I want to be able to program my radios in the field (and while traveling).

I'm not really a repeater user, how often do you need to reprogram while on the go? I can add a single repeater to my two HTs pretty easily, but if I were doing a bunch, I'd want to use a computer. But, I could do it in a pinch.

Agree about consistent interfaces. An app would make it easy to access every feature on a radio.

It may be down to differences in how we use our radios, but I can't imagine a feature on an HT that would be easier to use by pulling out a 2nd radio (phone) to use it. I kind of have that now when I use APRS because I run the control software on my phone and it's tedious. Also, I use my radio a lot where phones don't have service, so it's not unusual to leave it behind.

Chris

[Clusterfrack]

For me, it's about having a better radio. I want fewer features and better performance in the core device. I do silly things like stand on mountain tops and talk to people 30-60 miles away. A radio that sings and dances but can't manage that is of no use to *me*.

Agree. But can't we have both a quality transceiver and a modern UX?

When I buy a new radio, I want it to be easy to update my frequencies. RepeaterBook is updated reasonably often, and is a good starting point.
Each frequency should be easy to find, based on its location and other parameters.

As in magically appear as you move into range of a new repeater? Would it retain the old repeaters or remove them as you moved out of range? What dictated that range? There are repeaters I can reach from close to 100 miles away, especially if I'm on a mountain top, and others I can't touch more than 20 miles away.
[/QUOTE]

I would want my iPhone app to be able to search for repeaters in the area, and then populate a set of channels in my radio.

Given how little memory it requires to store frequency and repeater settings, I don't see any reason to erase old settings. Just flag them by date, location, group, and make it easy to find them while driving or hiking. As well, I'd like to be able to share settings with other users to make it easy to use the same stations.

As it is, I use a system that codes stations by geographic location and link group--all in 16 characters. Some radios can't even store 16 characters.

I agree it's awful, but it's so much better than what came before. Agree completely on the cables. I have 4 radios and 3 cables. I don't have 4 cables because one of those radios is dead simple and used for simplex only, so don't need to program anything.

Yep. There should be zero cables. It's 2021. We have ways to interface with devices that don't require cables.

I'm not really a repeater user, how often do you need to reprogram while on the go? I can add a single repeater to my two HTs pretty easily, but if I were doing a bunch, I'd want to use a computer. But, I could do it in a pinch.

It may be down to differences in how we use our radios, but I can't imagine a feature on an HT that would be easier to use by pulling out a 2nd radio (phone) to use it. I kind of have that now when I use APRS because I run the control software on my phone and it's tedious. Also, I use my radio a lot where phones don't have service, so it's not unusual to leave it behind.

Yes, I think we use our radios very differently. I almost always use repeaters, and when available, linked repeaters. I do not participate in Ham group events or competitions. I would use APRS, except it's hard to set up and occupies one of my VX-8's 2 transceivers. If I had an app that made it easy to set up and turn APRS on and off, I would use it more.

And no matter how far out I am, I'm never without my iPhone--especially because it makes using my InReach satellite device so much easier.

[mtnbkr]

[QUOTE=Clusterfrack;1197223]Agree. But can't we have both a quality transceiver and a modern UX?
I'd be happy to have both, but I put the priority for me on receiver performance, reliability, and durability. I already deal with a miniature computer (phone) in my pocket daily and sit in front of one at work. I kind of like going out into the field and not having that aspect of my life follow me there.

I would want my iPhone app to be able to search for repeaters in the area, and then populate a set of channels in my radio.

Given how little memory it requires to store frequency and repeater settings, I don't see any reason to erase old settings. Just flag them by date, location, group, and make it easy to find them while driving or hiking. As well, I'd like to be able to share settings with other users to make it easy to use the same stations.

Gotcha! I thought you were doing that searching and repeater management via the radio itself.

As it is, I use a system that codes stations by geographic location and link group--all in 16 characters. Some radios can't even store 16 characters.

I know. There are a few clubs in the region that have multiple repeaters for different bands. I try to store them by club call sign and the band, but don't always have enough space.

Yep. There should be zero cables. It's 2021. We have ways to interface with devices that don't require cables.

Baby steps. Let's get a standardized physical interface first.

Yes, I think we use our radios very differently. I almost always use repeaters, and when available, linked repeaters. I do not participate in Ham group events or competitions. I would use APRS, except it's hard to set up and occupies one of my VX-8's 2 transceivers. If I had an app that made it easy to set up and turn APRS on and off, I would use it more.

I seldom use repeaters. I think I have about 5, maybe 10 minutes of time on repeaters since getting my license 15 years ago. I keep a few plugged into my VX-7 because that's kind of my outdoor-adventure-multipurpose HT (waterproof, quad-band, etc). My SOTA-specific 2m one doesn't have any repeaters programmed.

I mainly use APRS for two purposes: to self-spot for SOTA when I don't have a cell signal and to send my wife text messages also when I'm out of range.

Semi-related: https://www.outsideonline.com/242147...o-hobby-summit

Chris

[Wheeler]

What are you looking for? There are several independent shops that could work on your radio. One thing hams are good at is keeping older radios running.

I'm looking for a replacement LCD screen. Yaesu will sell me the entire front panel assembly for just under $200. If you have a source for the LCD only I'd appreciate it.

What does "sustained field use" mean? People like to claim the Elecraft KX2 is too delicate and not good for that sort of thing, but I still manage to take it camping, hiking, and biking.
There have been a few good entrances into the portable market this year, but COVID has delayed widespread rollout (Lab599 for example). I saw the Icom 705 at HRO the other day. It's a nice radio, but too chunky for my needs.

Chris

I may be LARPing a bit here, if so please bear with me.

I got into this for the specific purpose of having non-infrastructure dependent communications with family members in other states. To me that means not having the benefit of climate controlled facilities such as what recently happened to the folks in Texas. I spent a lot of time looking at the various QRP radios with the idea of having something packable in mind. I've spent a fair amount of time drooling over the Lab599 as well as the LNR LT11. I think the Lab599 is an excellent attempt at something that would somewhat ruggedized as well. I'm not looking for a green radio like a SINCGARS, just something that is not so susceptible to condensation and being bumped around in a pack.

[mtnbkr]

I'm looking for a replacement LCD screen. Yaesu will sell me the entire front panel assembly for just under $200. If you have a source for the LCD only I'd appreciate it.

Just under $200 for a major component in an out-of-production radio doesn't seem too bad. It should be more or less drop-in.

A quick google search turned up this: https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?thr...screen.728231/
which led to this source for a non-Yaesu replacement for $75: http://vk5kbb.com/vk5kbb2_003.htm

I'd be inclined to get the factory replacement while they're still available to ensure fully compatibility and a refresh of other components.

I may be LARPing a bit here, if so please bear with me.

I got into this for the specific purpose of having non-infrastructure dependent communications with family members in other states. To me that means not having the benefit of climate controlled facilities such as what recently happened to the folks in Texas. I spent a lot of time looking at the various QRP radios with the idea of having something packable in mind. I've spent a fair amount of time drooling over the Lab599 as well as the LNR LT11. I think the Lab599 is an excellent attempt at something that would somewhat ruggedized as well. I'm not looking for a green radio like a SINCGARS, just something that is not so susceptible to condensation and being bumped around in a pack.

Virtually all of my operating is portable outdoors. The link I provided in my previous post about SOTA is what I'm into. I also do Parks On The Air (POTA), but typically do parks I can either bike to or involve some hiking ("parks" include WMAs, National Parks, and State or National forests). My radio, an Elecraft KX2 (there's a picture of one being used in that SOTA article), spends a lot of time in packs and being operated in less than ideal conditions. While I wouldn't pull it out in driving rain, I have used it while being snowed on and in temps ranging from the 20s on up to the 80s (only got it this past Fall). Prior to getting the KX2, I had an FT-817nd for about 12 years. It too held up well, but I wanted the KX2 for the size and for some features not found in the 817. I've heard stories of people doing SOTA activation dropping the 817 or having heavy rocks falling on it, so I'd class it as "durable". The KX2 is not as durable, but I haven't run into problems as a result. Are either susceptible to moisture? Probably after a fashion, but nothing that has been an issue for me.

The Lab599 looks really good, but I haven't seen one in the flesh yet. I have a local HMO, so once they have them in stock, I may go check one out in person. Do you mean LNR LD-11? I can't find an LT11. The LD-11 looks interesting, but I haven't heard anything yet. Their Mountain Topper CW rigs are popular and strong performers.

Chris

[Wheeler]

Just under $200 for a major component in an out-of-production radio doesn't seem too bad. It should be more or less drop-in.

A quick google search turned up this: https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?thr...screen.728231/
which led to this source for a non-Yaesu replacement for $75: http://vk5kbb.com/vk5kbb2_003.htm

I'd be inclined to get the factory replacement while they're still available to ensure fully compatibility and a refresh of other components.




Virtually all of my operating is portable outdoors. The link I provided in my previous post about SOTA is what I'm into. I also do Parks On The Air (POTA), but typically do parks I can either bike to or involve some hiking ("parks" include WMAs, National Parks, and State or National forests). My radio, an Elecraft KX2 (there's a picture of one being used in that SOTA article), spends a lot of time in packs and being operated in less than ideal conditions. While I wouldn't pull it out in driving rain, I have used it while being snowed on and in temps ranging from the 20s on up to the 80s (only got it this past Fall). Prior to getting the KX2, I had an FT-817nd for about 12 years. It too held up well, but I wanted the KX2 for the size and for some features not found in the 817. I've heard stories of people doing SOTA activation dropping the 817 or having heavy rocks falling on it, so I'd class it as "durable". The KX2 is not as durable, but I haven't run into problems as a result. Are either susceptible to moisture? Probably after a fashion, but nothing that has been an issue for me.

The Lab599 looks really good, but I haven't seen one in the flesh yet. I have a local HMO, so once they have them in stock, I may go check one out in person. Do you mean LNR LD-11? I can't find an LT11. The LD-11 looks interesting, but I haven't heard anything yet. Their Mountain Topper CW rigs are popular and strong performers.

Chris

I have been to that guy’s page several times and never saw that link for the screens. Go figure...Thanks for the link.

I fully intend to start getting involved in the SOTA, POTA activations. I figure it will be good practice and experience.

You are correct. The LD-11. It has already been discontinued. There’s an updated version that’s an SDR but is only being marketed in Europe as best I can figure.

I’m glad to hear the radios are tougher than I’d been led to believe. I also looked long and hard at the FT-817/818s. Finding the FT-897 at a local-ish Hamfest for $400 was one of the major deciding factors in buying it, even knowing about the faulty display up front. Another $200 is blowing the budget I set, as I was trying to stay under $1000 for an HF/VHF/UHF ‘base station’ with antennas that is capable of FT8, Winlink, or one of the other digital “texting” options. That might be unrealistic budget but I’m going to try to stick to it.

Thanks for the advice and feedback.

[mtnbkr]

I fully intend to start getting involved in the SOTA, POTA activations. I figure it will be good practice and experience.

It's just plain fun and is good justification for new radios.

BTW, depending on how active SOTA is your area, 2m FM with an HT and good antenna (j-pole, Arrow II yagi, etc) can be very productive. I've done all but two of my activations this calendar year on 2m. I could have done those two on 2m, but I wanted to play on HF.

POTA is typically HF-oriented, though I did "chase" an local activator on 2m. No reason not to try...

Chris