Tuning the P-07/P-09

[spinmove_]

There’s plenty of knowledge and buzz around here on making Berettas more awesomer. Not a lot on making these sing around here just yet. Right now I’m just looking to clean up the press and lighten the DA weight. Later when I get a full Production rig I’d be down for doing more if necessary.

I see Cajun Gun Works has got a few different packages listed for duty/carry and for competition. Not sure if CZ Custom has similar packages, I’ve just heard CGW typically has the parts you want.

Specifically I’d be looking to modify my P-07 for carry for now. Already eyeing the Dawson sights, flat hammer spring plug, reduced power TRS, and possibly their pro-grade spring package.

Should I do anything different/additionally or should I be doing something different?


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[Clusterfrack]

Here’s some info pasted from previous threads, plus a little more. Personally, I like CGWs work and parts better than CZC, especially for a carry gun.

[QUOTE=Clusterfrack;744301]Short answer is if you're willing to spend an hour or two working the trigger, you probably don't need to send it to CGW. If you're in the market for a new P-07, buying it directly from them with the kit installed is a good way to go. If you want to carry a gun that you understand mechanically, then installing the kit yourself like I did is a good project.

NOTE: There are two potentially problematic issues with the P-07/09, but both are easily solvable.

1) The guns are not designed to be dryfired. "Unprotected" dryfire smashes the firing pin into the FP retaining roll pin, causing damage to the roll pin. Eventually, this can cause a malfunction where the FP does not move freely. I insert a half a foam earplug between the hammer and firing pin to protect the FP roll pin from peening. I also installed a CGW tempered steel roll pin that resists damage.

2) As with other CZs there are reports of trigger return springs breaking. This appears to be much less of an issue in the P-07/09 than with the CZ-75 line, and my OEM trigger return spring has been fine so far (thousands of cycles). The armorers manual lists 20000 rounds as the replacement interval for the TRS. An obvious solution is to replace the trigger return spring with a CGW spring, which I used in my Shadow 2's. These are very durable, and can last for over 50,000 cycles.

Now on to the break-in process:
I cleaned the gun, lubricated the action with Lucas grease and oil. Then I dryfired the gun in DA for a few hundred cycles. Think of this as a workout for your trigger fingers. I used compressed air to blow out the sear area, and re-lubricated with grease.

Next, focusing on rough spots in the single action pull, I worked the trigger repeatedly without dropping the hammer.

The result was dramatic. DA pull dropped from over 13# to 9#, the low end of the published spec for this gun. The SA pull smoothed out as well. Now if you aren't familiar with them, the OEM gun is hard to distinguish from the CGW ProGrade gun. The CGW P-07 has a crisper SA break, and a slightly shorter reset.

Am I glad I spent the time and money to install a ProGrade kit on one gun? Absolutely. The gun is amazing. And it was worth it to learn how the P-07 works and to gain confidence in the design. It's a remarkably simple and well-engineered system. I especially like the ability to tune the weight of the SA pull using the CGW increased weight sear springs. Since I carry it, I chose the heaviest 0.020" spring to increase the SA pull to 4# in the ProGrade gun (stock weight is listed as 3.3 - 5.5lbs).

I replaced the trigger return spring in my stock P-07 with the CGW TRS because of the added durability. It is supposed to reduce the DA pull by about 1/2 lb. I had a hard time noticing or measuring a difference in the DA pull. However the SA pull was measurably lower, around 3.5#, I swapped in a CGW heavy sear spring (0.020"), which brings the SA up to 4.25 to 4.5#, actually heavier than with all OEM springs. I think this setup is perfect for a carry gun.

I recently discovered that the smoothness of the SA pull depends in part on fitting and lubrication of the sear spring. A bit of grease helps a lot. Also make sure the open end of the spring is facing left when looking from the muzzle end of the gun.

[Lon]

Cluster has some good advice.

Here's what I did. I bought the Pro-Grade kit from CGW and installed the parts myself. I did some additional polishing to a couple parts. That's been thousands of rounds ago and I have not had any issues. Currently I've got 2 slides for my 07. The original slide was sent to Mark H at L&M for an RMR install. I bought a second slide - an original 07 Duty slide - from Stuart at CZC and put a set of Dawson sights on it (FO front, black rear). If I were you (since it's a carry gun) I would look at the new Night Fusion sights or these from CZC:
https://czcustom.com/cz-parts-all/fr...m-tritium.html
https://czcustom.com/cz-parts-all/fr...r-tritium.html

[ranger]

I usually try to gunsmith my own - for once I just paid for a CGW Pro-grade P09 with all the bells and whistles and had delivered to my local FFL.

[holmes168]

@Clusterfrack how much alike are the P-07, P-09, and a Shadow 2? Are the very consistent in manipulation? A ccw, nightstand and gaming pistol trio?

I really like the price of the P-07 for sure.

[Clusterfrack]

@holmes168, I find the P-07 and Shadow 2 quite similar. Like a G19 and a gamer G34 with a custom trigger. Of course the weight couldn’t be more different. And I’ve had to add decocking to my defensive drills with the P-07 (see the thread on that).

I like having multiple of the same gun for carry and general defense, so I’d probably go with a second P-07 for home as well. But your plan makes good sense too.

[Clusterfrack]

I can’t help adding something here. If you browse the Web, you’ll find all manner of Bubba mods for CZs. Grinding sear geometry, bending trigger bar springs, all sorts of fuckery. In my personal opinion, I recommend strongly against any of that. If I thought the P-07 needed anything more invasive than what I’ve listed above, I don’t think I would trust it as a carry/defense gun. I like that the P-07 is Glock-like in having a robust design that works reliably.

[spinmove_]

[QUOTE=Clusterfrack;755021]Here’s some info pasted from previous threads, plus a little more. Personally, I like CGWs work and parts better than CZC, especially for a carry gun.

Short answer is if you're willing to spend an hour or two working the trigger, you probably don't need to send it to CGW. If you're in the market for a new P-07, buying it directly from them with the kit installed is a good way to go. If you want to carry a gun that you understand mechanically, then installing the kit yourself like I did is a good project.

NOTE: There are two potentially problematic issues with the P-07/09, but both are easily solvable.

1) The guns are not designed to be dryfired. "Unprotected" dryfire smashes the firing pin into the FP retaining roll pin, causing damage to the roll pin. Eventually, this can cause a malfunction where the FP does not move freely. I insert a half a foam earplug between the hammer and firing pin to protect the FP roll pin from peening. I also installed a CGW tempered steel roll pin that resists damage.

2) As with other CZs there are reports of trigger return springs breaking. This appears to be much less of an issue in the P-07/09 than with the CZ-75 line, and my OEM trigger return spring has been fine so far (thousands of cycles). The armorers manual lists 20000 rounds as the replacement interval for the TRS. An obvious solution is to replace the trigger return spring with a CGW spring, which I used in my Shadow 2's. These are very durable, and can last for over 50,000 cycles.

Now on to the break-in process:
I cleaned the gun, lubricated the action with Lucas grease and oil. Then I dryfired the gun in DA for a few hundred cycles. Think of this as a workout for your trigger fingers. I used compressed air to blow out the sear area, and re-lubricated with grease.

Next, focusing on rough spots in the single action pull, I worked the trigger repeatedly without dropping the hammer.

The result was dramatic. DA pull dropped from over 13# to 9#, the low end of the published spec for this gun. The SA pull smoothed out as well. Now if you aren't familiar with them, the OEM gun is hard to distinguish from the CGW ProGrade gun. The CGW P-07 has a crisper SA break, and a slightly shorter reset.

Am I glad I spent the time and money to install a ProGrade kit on one gun? Absolutely. The gun is amazing. And it was worth it to learn how the P-07 works and to gain confidence in the design. It's a remarkably simple and well-engineered system. I especially like the ability to tune the weight of the SA pull using the CGW increased weight sear springs. Since I carry it, I chose the heaviest 0.020" spring to increase the SA pull to 4# in the ProGrade gun (stock weight is listed as 3.3 - 5.5lbs).

I replaced the trigger return spring in my stock P-07 with the CGW TRS because of the added durability. It is supposed to reduce the DA pull by about 1/2 lb. I had a hard time noticing or measuring a difference in the DA pull. However the SA pull was measurably lower, around 3.5#, I swapped in a CGW heavy sear spring (0.020"), which brings the SA up to 4.25 to 4.5#, actually heavier than with all OEM springs. I think this setup is perfect for a carry gun.

I recently discovered that the smoothness of the SA pull depends in part on fitting and lubrication of the sear spring. A bit of grease helps a lot. Also make sure the open end of the spring is facing left when looking from the muzzle end of the gun.

Ok, so definitely the CGW Tempered Steel Roll Pin and the RP-TRS. Does the work you described include the whole Pro-Grade kit or just the Pro-Grade Springs?


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[Clusterfrack]

ok, so definitely the CGW Tempered Steel Roll Pin and the RP-TRS. Does the work you described include the whole Pro-Grade kit or just the Pro-Grade Springs?


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

One gun has just those two parts, plus a heavy sear spring.

The other has a full CGW ProGrade kit.

I’d go either nearly stock, or Full ProGrade.

Also: CZ USA has the P-07 Armorer's Manual for $39. It's a quality publication with nice photos of everything. A little expensive for what it is, but I'm glad I have it. While you're shopping there, you might as well pick up spare pins, a slide stop, and an extra decocker spring or two. It's nice that parts are so cheap. (Another Glock-like feature).

NOTE: getting the decocker spring back on the decocker during reassembly can be difficult and frustrating. I recommend making a special tool by grinding a notch in a tiny flat blade screwdriver. Lots of light, and reading glasses help too. It's the only obviously stupidly engineered part of the whole gun.

[spinmove_]

One gun has just those two parts, plus a heavy sear spring.

The other has a full CGW ProGrade kit.

I’d go either nearly stock, or Full ProGrade.

Also: CZ USA has the P-07 Armorer's Manual for $39. It's a quality publication with nice photos of everything. A little expensive for what it is, but I'm glad I have it. While you're shopping there, you might as well pick up spare pins, a slide stop, and an extra decocker spring or two. It's nice that parts are so cheap. (Another Glock-like feature).

NOTE: getting the decocker spring back on the decocker during reassembly can be difficult and frustrating. I recommend making a special tool by grinding a notch in a tiny flat blade screwdriver. Lots of light, and reading glasses help too. It's the only obviously stupidly engineered part of the whole gun.

Awesome, thank you very much! Yeah, the manual will come in handy. I’d normally look such things up on YouTube, but given their policies as of late, I’d feel much better simply having a quality resource like that straight from the mothership on hand.

I guess I have my shopping list and some work to do. I might need some specialized punches though, given that it’s not a Glock. Any recommendations there?


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