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Thread: Shooting 92 low on DA shot--guidance requested

  1. #1
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    Shooting 92 low on DA shot--guidance requested

    Need some help from folks that are experienced with either DA/SA or Beretta 92.

    Problem: Shooting ridiculously low in DA. Like 6-8” low at 7-15 yds. At 25 yds I’m probably a foot low. In SA I can keep 3” groups at 25 yds consistently. In dry fire the sight doesn’t move. Its very steady.

    Background and Objective

    Objective.
    I’ve been working to transition over to DA/SA system. The DA shot has consistently flummoxed me. I get frustrated and concerned about accuracy in DA mode and switch back to striker fired system because of consistently accurate results.

    I want to correct this issue without trigger modification.

    Hands.
    I consider my hands to be on the small side. However the trigger reach is about the same between G19 and 92. I don’t notice a perceivable difference. I’ve tried multiple different grip positions to no meaningful and consistently good result.

    Pistol.
    I shoot a bone stock 92. Trigger, sights, grips. This problem exists across all versions of 92: M9, 92A1, Brigadier, 92FS.
    I tried some VZ grips that were thinner and it made an improvement but not enough. For instance, at 25 yds, freestyle shooting, with stock grips I can get 6-8 shots on a 12x12 target. Not a good grouping mind you—I’m happy to just get on paper. With the VZ grips this improved to 10-12 shots on paper. The grouping is still barely on the lower portion of target.

    I use ‘drive-the-dot’ sight picture. It’s the same sight picture for SA shooting where the performance is acceptable.

    For comparison my experience with a bone stock, including sights, G19, I can get a reliable 8-10” group at 25 yds—drawing from concealment inside a 2.8 par time. Over, and over, and over.

    Questions

    Is this a genuine hardware-hand mismatch problem?

    Has anyone ever had this issue and successfully minimized it?

    If you were 6-8” low on the first DA shot would you still carry it? (I think know the answer here but wanted to offer it as a discussion point around ‘carry what you are good with vs. what you want to be good with’.)

    Thanks for any guidance on this.

    I’ve searched here and elsewhere and have not found any situations that reflect this issue.
    Last edited by fixer; 06-09-2018 at 10:01 AM.

  2. #2
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    Shooting 92 low on DA shot--guidance requested

    How hard are you gripping the gun? If your grip is loose at the beginning of the trigger stroke, you may be tightening your other fingers as you move your trigger finger.

    I know you said you wanted to avoid modifying triggers, but consider installing a D mainspring. It makes DA a lot easier to learn, IMHO. You can easily switch it back to stock later if you want.
    Last edited by Dave J; 06-09-2018 at 10:55 AM.

  3. #3
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    I suffer from the same issue with the Beretta 92-series pistols. For me, the following is needed.

    1) I worked on my grip. I have to hold the 92-series much more firmly than other pistols. The issue is really obvious with SHO as I can see the muzzle dip as I squeeze the trigger.

    2) I need ultra thin grips like the LTT VZ grips.

    3) "D" mainspring or lighter means less trigger pull force so other fingers are not pulling the pistol downward. LTT trigger work helps much more.

  4. #4
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    Thanks for replies.

    I'm gonna try shooting without pinky on grip to see if milking trigger is issue.

    I noticed a somewhat reliable increase in accuracy the harder I gripped the gun. The problem was that you run out of squeeze, if you will.

  5. #5
    Site Supporter GuanoLoco's Avatar
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    At the risk of stating the obvious, you are not moving your trigger finger independently of the rest of your hand during the DA trigger pull. When you have to pull harder than you expect/are used to, your entire hand is tensing up and you aren’t visually keeping the sights on target until the shot breaks. There is a fair chance your weak hand grip is less than 100%. There is a fair chance you are closing your eyes before the shot breaks and simply can’t see the sights move before the shot breaks.
    Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Doodie Project?

  6. #6
    Site Supporter hufnagel's Avatar
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    Random snap caps in a mag will help cure it.
    Rules to live by: 1. Eat meat, 2. Shoot guns, 3. Fire, 4. Gasoline, 5. Make juniors
    TDA: Learn it. Live it. Love it.... Read these: People Management Triggers 1, 2, 3
    If anyone sees a broken image of mine, please PM me.

  7. #7
    Move only the trigger. Same speed start to finish.

    Don’t try to make it go off with faster or slower trigger finger.

    No drama. No excited motion. Just move the trigger


    If I was 6-8” low, I would not carry it until I was more in tune with it.

    In fact I would I re evaluate my prior carry gun at distances beyond my comfort zone to assure the problem hasn’t been lingering longer.

    I say this because I did just the same when switching from Glock to the brig tac

    I now shoot DA guns better than I ever shot glocks and don’t plan on going to a different trigger system
    Last edited by Duke; 06-09-2018 at 12:40 PM.

  8. #8
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    I'm not trying to start a pissing match, a common cause is that people read too BS on the internet about the difference between DA and SA trigger pulls, and start creating little issues in their minds over things that aren't that big of deal. Yes there is a difference between a DA and SA trigger pull, unless you have little bitty hands, it's only an issue if you make it one. If you really believe that there's a problem, subconsciously you will make it happen.

    Another common causes of this is that the shooter isn't focusing on their front sight, is looking over the sights for that first low shot, and dipping the muzzle down as the shot breaks to look at the target.

    If you're ok in dry fire, it's probably something going on between your ears. I think if you can quit thinking about about the DA and SA trigger pulls on your Beretta, and just do the best you can to be fundamentally sound on your side of the gun, most of the issues on the other side of things will improve.
    Whether you think you can or you can't, you're probably right.

  9. #9
    Site Supporter hufnagel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by txdpd View Post
    I'm not trying to start a pissing match, a common cause is that people read too BS on the internet about the difference between DA and SA trigger pulls, and start creating little issues in their minds over things that aren't that big of deal. Yes there is a difference between a DA and SA trigger pull, unless you have little bitty hands, it's only an issue if you make it one. If you
    If you're ok in dry fire, it's probably something going on between your ears. I think if you can quit thinking about about the DA and SA trigger pulls on your Beretta, and just do the best you can to be fundamentally sound on your side of the gun, most of the issues on the other side of things will improve.
    I'll agree with that. Hence why I suggested to use Snap caps. It seemed to work pretty well for me.
    Rules to live by: 1. Eat meat, 2. Shoot guns, 3. Fire, 4. Gasoline, 5. Make juniors
    TDA: Learn it. Live it. Love it.... Read these: People Management Triggers 1, 2, 3
    If anyone sees a broken image of mine, please PM me.

  10. #10
    I'm not a guru like a lot of these folks but here is a suggestion that worked for me. One of those little guitar thinga jigs that works your fingers independently. Not so much for strength although learning to chord a guitar showed me how weak my fingers were in comparison to my whole hand strength. Thing is it teaches you to put whatever pressure with whatever finger, in this case your trigger finger without the others changing their pressure. I found that when I was able to isolate my trigger fingers strength without tensing the others the da low thing went away. Mine was not on a beretta as I have big hands but on ruger redhawk. Overall the help with trigger control was serious enough I say it's worth a try for a couple of weeks. Worst thing that happens is your trigger finger gets stronger right?

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