American Rifleman: Testing the 38 Special

[jetfire]

Pretty much all the smart wheelgun dudes I know gave up on expansion out of a J-frame a long time ago and have settled for a load that shoots to the sights and gets good penetration - the venerable 148 grain full wadcutter.

[Tokarev]

So which 158gr LSWCHP to test?

It looks like I answered my own question as I found a box of ammo locally. Am not expecting to see much difference from the Lucky Gunner tests even though I won't be using Clear Gel.



Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

[Tokarev]

I wish Federal would listen up and make the damn 147-grain HST bullet in .357" diameter @ 850-900fps. I'm willing to bet that load would deliver 13" of penetration, excellent expansion, and near perfect accuracy in all snubs across the board.

I should really pull a few 147-grain HSTs from 9mm guns and load them up over about 5-grains of Unique and fire them for penetration and expansion. .

https://americanreloading.com/en/9mm...hst-500ct.html

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

[Tokarev]

I'll hopefully play with my little collection of lead hollow points here in the next week or so.

I have a 130 grain cast bullet that wants to open to .70" but with shallow penetration. I am hoping to find a velocity that retards expansion and allows for deeper penetration but haven't found it yet. It seems to be an "all or nothing" type of deal.

The other cast bullet I'm playing with is a 145 grain SWC. At 950-1,000 fps the bullet expands pretty well but it does shed a little weight. It is, however, getting right at 12" of penetration in bare gel. I'm hoping to get another inch or two by using the heavy clothing barrier.

The other two loads I'll try is the Remington 158 pictured previously and a cast full wadcutter load from Double Tap.

Here's the 130 grain:



At higher velocity it opens like this although penetration is limited to about 8 inches:




And the 145 grain LSWCHP. This is with a light 357 Magnum charge of Unique. Recovered weight is about 120 grains:

[mtnbkr]

I have a 130 grain cast bullet that wants to open to .70" but with shallow penetration. I am hoping to find a velocity that retards expansion and allows for deeper penetration but haven't found it yet. It seems to be an "all or nothing" type of deal.

What velocity?

Are you casting these yourself? If so, have you tried a harder alloy?

Chris

[Tokarev]

What velocity?

Are you casting these yourself? If so, have you tried a harder alloy?

Chris

The 130 grain opens nicely from about 850-950 fps but doesn't make 12" at these speeds. Dropping down to the mid-7's gives no expansion and about 14" of penetration.

The 130 and 145 grain were bought from GT Bullets. The prices are pretty good and he'll sell in lots of 100. Matt's Bullets also has a couple different weights for the 38 although I haven't tried any of his.

Matt's 148 RN HP might be my next experiment if I can't get the 130 to behave like I want.

http://www.gtbullets.com/index.php?m...rrniigauvgs9d0

http://www.mattsbullets.com/index.ph...fqi2dcqd80tp93

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

[mtnbkr]

The 130 grain opens nicely from about 850-950 fps but doesn't make 12" at these speeds. Dropping down to the mid-7's gives no expansion and about 14" of penetration.

That's a narrow range of performance. With it not expanding in the mid 700s, but over expanding at 850+, I'm now thinking the alloy is too hard. Per the pics, but the HP is quite large, so there should be plenty of hydraulic pressure to open it up (as evidenced by the overexpansion and reduced penetration at higher velocities). With a softer alloy, it could perform better in the lower velocity ranges with reduced hydraulic pressure in the HP.

GT claims this is what they use in those bullets:
http://www.gtbullets.com/index.php?m...products_id=75

If I were casting the bullets, I'd consider reducing the Antimony. Increasing the tin could make it a bit tougher, but I forget where more tin stops being useful...

Chris

[Tokarev]

If I were casting the bullets, I'd consider reducing the Antimony. Increasing the tin could make it a bit tougher, but I forget where more tin stops being useful...

Chris

I had some cast hollow points from another maker (bought off gunbroker I don't recall the user name) that were a hard alloy. Supposedly a hunting bullet. They crumbled/broke apart in gel.

[Tokarev]

Here's another option for cast lead hollow points. Note that the 125gr 38 bullet (about halfway down the page) looks like it could be made from the same mold that GT uses. Also appears to suffer from shallow penetration...

https://www.andersonballistics.com/our-products.html

[mtnbkr]

I had some cast hollow points from another maker (bought off gunbroker I don't recall the user name) that were a hard alloy. Supposedly a hunting bullet. They crumbled/broke apart in gel.

Which means their alloy was hard but not tough enough.

You can adjust hardness and toughness via alloy, heat treating, and quenching.

You can make a bullet that does what you want, but finding a commercial offering is challenging. Most of the casters I know of who know how to make a tough bullet for high velocity work in larger calibers or heavier bullets intended for big or dangerous game.

Which is all academic because you're looking to buy, not cast. I'm afraid your choices will be limited and if you find that grail bullet, it'll not be commonly available to the average person (ie at Cabelas or Midway).

Chris