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Thread: Newhall Incident Anniversary

  1. #1
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    Newhall Incident Anniversary

    48 years ago this month the terribly tragic Newhall Incident occurred that resulted in the deaths of four young California highway patrolmen. Many l.e. persons recognize the event as the force that started a movement in revolutionizing the way that police officers are trained. Officer James Pence was one of the young men who lost his life. One erroneous statement about Officer Pence was published and then became part of a myth that took decades to correct. The erroneous fact is that investigators found empty brass inside this man's pocket. From this false report was born the myth that Officer Pence did pocket his brass during the gunfight with the implication that doing so caused him to be killed. Not true. Police trainer Mark Schraer is one author who has documented the truth in this matter. Old rumors die hard, though.

    Then CHP officers trained with .38 Spl ammo but were issued .357 mag ammo. CHP's answer was to require issue of .38 spl ammo. One error made was how the 870 shotgun was handled. CHP revised this procedure too. After reading about the incident(this time), I concluded that had one of the two patrolman who first answered the call been armed with an AR-15, the Newhall Incident probably would have been prevented. I lack the knowledge to comment further. What I wrote does not begin to address how the incident has influenced training and procedures.
    Last edited by willie; 04-14-2018 at 01:08 AM.

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    Site Supporter Hambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by willie View Post
    I concluded that had one of the two patrolman who first answered the call been armed with an AR-15, the Newhall Incident probably would have been prevented.
    They had enough tools to get the job done. The problem was the training and tactics of the era in general and CHP specifically.
    "Gunfighting is a thinking man's game. So we might want to bring thinking back into it."-MDFA

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    Site Supporter 41magfan's Avatar
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    Since the dawn of time, the (7) Principles Cooper is known for codifying will always be applicable and relevant, regardless of which side of the fight you're on. The sooner the good guys (LEO's and citizens alike) embrace that notion and stop relying on hardware to make them successful, the better off they'll be.
    The path of least resistance will seldom get you where you need to be.

  4. #4
    I agree with Hambo about tactics being the issue rather than the weapons that were available to the officers. There is an article on the Newhall Incident on The Tactical Professor (Claude Werner) website. It includes some old training videos from the CHP & LASO based on the incident as well.

    A citizen with a HUGE set of balls, Mr. Gary Kness, ran to the aid of the officers, three of whom were already down, and the fourth under fire. He attempted to drag a fallen officer out of the line of fire and then engaged one of the suspects with the fallen officer's weapons. Once the last officer was shot, and his own weapon was out of ammunition, Mr. Kness fled. Thank you and God Bless you Mr. Kness, wherever you are.

    RIP Officers Frago, Gore, Alleyn & Pence. Your deaths were not in vain. The tactics now taught, that have saved many officers from a similar fate, are based on lessons learned from Newhall.

  5. #5
    Member zero67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SWAT Lt. View Post
    A citizen with a HUGE set of balls, Mr. Gary Kness, ran to the aid of the officers
    There's an interview from 2009 in which Gary Kness describes his involvement and activities. Skip ahead to 2:50 if you want to go straight to it.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh95SWjziBA

    For me, Newhall happened just before I entered the academy in another state, and I've never forgotten it or those four young guys who were the same age as me.

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    A couple recent books on the topic are

    The Newhall Incident by Marsh Cassady and John Anderson
    Newhall Shooting: A Tactical Analysis by Michael E. Wood

    Massad Ayoob did detailed articles on the Newhall Incident in both "American Handgunner" and "The Police Marksman" around the time of the 20th anniversary (1990)

    I came on as a cop in 1981 and that incident was still a relatively recent and influential event in police training and I remember we saw a couple movies about it in the police academy

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    Site Supporter Trooper224's Avatar
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    Mike Wood's Newhall Shooting: A Tactical Analysis and Ed Mireles' FBI Miami Firefight should be in every cops library.

    An AR15 probably wouldn't have made a difference. Mindset and tactics were the deciding factors at Newhall. The felons were ready to kill, the officers were not. The officers involved were trained to be bullseye shooters, not gunfighters.
    We may lose and we may win, but we will never be here again.......

  8. #8
    banana republican blues's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trooper224 View Post
    Mike Wood's Newhall Shooting: A Tactical Analysis and Ed Mireles' FBI Miami Firefight should be in every cops library.

    An AR15 probably wouldn't have made a difference. Mindset and tactics were the deciding factors at Newhall. The felons were ready to kill, the officers were not. The officers involved were trained to be bullseye shooters, not gunfighters.
    I pulled out a copy last night to look at after you mentioned it. Started reading but it was getting late and I need to study the diagrams and timeline again.

    Eagerly awaiting the Mireles book. I'm sure there will be a lot in it that will resonate with me.
    There's nothing civil about this war.

    Read: Harrison Bergeron

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    Site Supporter Trooper224's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blues View Post
    I pulled out a copy last night to look at after you mentioned it. Started reading but it was getting late and I need to study the diagrams and timeline again.

    Eagerly awaiting the Mireles book. I'm sure there will be a lot in it that will resonate with me.
    The CHP's firearms training at the time was considered quite progressive, sadly enough. The agency administration fostered an attitude that was completely opposed to promoting quick resolution through the use of violence. Regan was the newly elected governor and he'd run on a law and order platform, which resulted in the biggest expansion in the CHP's history. The result was a lack of experienced officers and at Newhall you had four rookies going into a gunfight. In many ways the agency set those boys up for failure.
    We may lose and we may win, but we will never be here again.......

  10. #10
    CWM11B
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    Just ordered both books. Another event I used in teaching and on patrol. Forget the past and at some point it will be relived. I have amassed a large collection of old shooting/gunfighting texts. I scour used bookshops and the internet for first editions, as I like the old book look and smell. It is astounding at how many of todays "revolutionary" or "cutting edge" techniques are in books that are going on 70 years or more.
    When still at my old agency, I would break out my copy of "Officer Down, Code 3" from motorola ( anybody have a link to the video? I cant seem to find one). That book and the old "Steet Survival" series are as tactically sound today as when they were written, minus, of course case law that came into effect after publication.

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