Not sure if this belongs in software or hardware.
I was working with my Px4 cc today and was trying to start pulling the first long trigger pull before I completly lined up the sites on the target. Not having a timer, it seemed like I was getting the first shot off a bit quicker.
So is this something everyone is already doing? And I'm just figuring it out? Or is this a bad practice?
I don't find it to be an issue. My trigger press may slow or speed up as the sight picture changes. I would not call thus staging, nor what you describe as staging. Staging would be running the trigger to a certain point and coming to a complete stop before finishing the press as a default.
https://youtu.be/FsoX26OhDCY
Get a shot timer to turn feelings into numbers.
It might be worth searching for "Press-out", which has been discussed here at length (particularly as it was central to ToddG's technique). With the press-out, the actions of sight alignment, trigger squeeze and presenting the pistol are all occurring simultaneously (vice sequentially) with the goal of breaking the shot as you reach full extension.
Ernest Langdon's classic 'Fear Not the Double Action Shot' article also discusses this...
As the pistol starts to move forward you should be able to pick up the position of the muzzle in your peripheral vision. As soon as you can see that the muzzle is on target, start pulling the trigger. This is where the speed of the first shot comes from. As the pistol goes out, the trigger comes back. Now it becomes a timing issue. As the pistol goes forward and comes up to your line of sight, you are trying to pull the trigger so that the hammer falls just as you clean up the sight picture. The last one to two inches of the presentation the sights should be almost perfect so if the shot breaks a little early you’re still going to hit the target. This is really no different than what most top shooters do with a single action pistol. They prep the trigger on the way out to the target and try and break the shot just as they clean up the sight picture.
He also touches on it in RECOIL: Double Action Auto - The Long Pull...
Aggressive to the trigger, with confidence! The first shot with a DA handgun has an advantage for most practical, real world shooters. Once the decision has been made to shoot, a shooter can be really aggressive to the trigger and start pulling it much earlier in the presentation to the target than would be possible with a single-action or striker-fired gun. For me, the biggest difference is that I have confidence that the gun won’t fire before I’m ready. Real success with a DA gun comes from combining the presentation of the pistol, aiming the gun, and pulling the trigger at the same time. The last part of the presentation to the target combines aiming and pulling through the rest of the double action trigger pull. With a single action or striker-fired gun, I have to wait until the last millisecond of the presentation and aiming to start pulling the trigger. Getting on the trigger early on a striker-fired mechanism leads to bad things happening.
"When the phone rang, Parker was in the garage, killing a man."
Thanks for the info everyone. I couldn't remember the correct term.
Ben Stoeger is an advocate of simply pulling the trigger straight through, and that is what I do. I do not stage the trigger on my TDA guns. I don't find it helpful on my competition guns, and I don't practice this with my defense guns. As @Leroy said, the speed of the trigger press is a function of the shot.
“There is no growth in the comfort zone.”--Jocko Willink
"You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
I agree with pulling straight through. I’ve never had good luck with staging the trigger personally on any trigger system, much less the DA press. Rowing right through the break smoothly and consistently has worked well for me.
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There is a small disconnect between thread title and what OP is describing. Staging usually means taking out most of a travel first, finishing alignment and then completing the press. This is almost universally felt to be a bad practice.
The first post describes working trigger while extending a gun, vs extending fully and then working trigger. I've tested the two extensively and for me the latter is slightly more consistent while the former is faster. There are other small details here, but that is the main message.
If you're just shooting competitively I don't think staging (or touching the trigger before the sights are aligned) will hurt anything. For defensive pistol, I think it's a horrible practice. We teach staging the trigger to officers and I think it contributes significantly to out of the holster ND's, first round misses and a couple questionable shootings. Staging sounds good in theory, but when the adrenaline is pumping, that kind of motor control isn't there. It also contributes to a lack of trigger discipline that I see with rifles, shotguns, and Glocks. Our officers are defaulting to the level of their training.
Decision to fire, sights on target, and then finger on the trigger. You might lose a couple fractions of a second, but my experience is that the people that think they are good enough to put their finger on the trigger before the sight are lined up disproportionately out number the people that actually good enough to pull it off.
Whether you think you can or you can't, you're probably right.
For a timer I use an app called "Splits" on my phone. Works great for practice and it was maybe $2. I start pulling the trigger just before the sights are perfectly in line. The final alignment is being done while the trigger is moving. I practice indoors and out at a 9 in paper plate w/ a 3 inch orange dot on it. This dot is equivalent to a 9 in plate at 60 ft which is the most difficult target for us in our local Steel Challenge. As I start pulling the trigger the sights are somewhere on the 9 in paper plate and I try to get them on to the 3 in dot before the shot fires. When I am missing too often I find that slowing down the trigger pull slightly helps as I have just a little more time to get onto that 3 in dot.
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