.44 Special loads

[Malamute]

The thread is a little old, but it seems to be the place to ask.

I recently picked up a Smith 624 and I would like to push 240-260gr SWCs at about 900-950FPS. To that end I have a bunch of Starline brass and some Rimrock 260gr Keith SWCs coming. My gun is a 6.5” model. I have Unique, Win 231, Titegroup, and CFE Pistol on hand. I would prefer to use Unique.

What I would like some assurance on is pressure. I cannot seem to get a straight answer from Google, but I gather the Skeeter load of 7.5gr Unique is probably in excess of the SAAMI spec for .44 Special. I also gather that the spec for this round is quite conservative so as to avoid blowing up guns of lesser construction. However, a lot of the discussion about these hotter loads being safe seems to involve heavily built Rugers.

My first question is whether these more stout .44s will be safe in a 1980s-mfg Smith and Wesson 624.

Second, to try to cheat my way there: I was planning on doing a ladder of 6, 6.5, 7, and 7.5 grains to find my velocity. Is that a safe assumption to get me to 900-950FPS with a 6.5” barrel?

Im certain the 1980s guns are built to better heat treat standards than the 1950s guns that Keith and many others were using for heavy loads before the 44 magnum came out. There were no guns coming apart that Ive heard of from his loads, though they probably arent the best for longest term longevity.

At the time they came out in the 80s "the word on the street" supposedly from factory sources was that they knew people were going to be shooting Keith type loads in them so they used the same materials and heat treat for cylinders as the model 29s. No concrete confirmation on that, but again, Ive not heard of anyone hurting one.

Ive shot some of the Keith loads in a 1980s blue 24, I dont recall the exact charge, its whatever the old NRA manual came up with as comparable to the older semi-balloon head cases with his load, but in solid head cases. I think they came up with 16.5 grs 2400 with the Lyman 429421 bullet at around 1200 fps, this all from memory. It spec'ed in the 20k+ psi pressure range, checked by the HP White lab, but I dont recall exactly where, I could look if anyone is interested. I have no qualms shooting those loads, but have little reason to since I have a 4" 29. I keep 6 in the belt when out walking around with the 24 since Im technically in grizzly country even at home, but dont go hang out where the bears do as much as I used to. They do in fact hit to the same point of impact as the 6 1/2gr Unique loads I normally have in the gun, as Keith mentioned his did with varying loads. I believe Dennis Hall shot a fair number of the Keith loads in his 1980s 624.

I dont think your going to bend or even begin to challenge that gun with the loads mentioned in your post.

[ssb]

Thank you!

[willie]

Hodgdon handles sales for Alliant, Winchester, and Accurate Arms powders. Their website will guide you. Unique is an Alliant powder. I urge you to consult vendors' data for reloading information and buy a recent manual too. Years ago some published data for Unique and 38 Spl actually resulted in 357 Magnum pressures. This example is merely one.

Unique is everybody's favorite powder and has been on the market since 1900. Recent findings show that Unique has a very high flame temp, and reloads with more than 7 grains will burn out the barrel throat if fired extensively. Consider 6.5 grains with your bullet to see what you get.

[revchuck38]

@ssb - You might want to give CFB-Pistol a try. It’s about the same burn speed as Unique. I’ve had good results with it in .38 Special and .40 S&W. I haven’t tried it in .44 Special though.

[Jim Watson]

Hodgdon handles sales for Alliant, Winchester, and Accurate Arms powders. Their website will guide you. Unique is an Alliant powder. I urge you to consult vendors' data for reloading information and buy a recent manual too.

I do not see Unique or other Alliant powders on the Hodgdon site, just Hodgdon, Winchester, IMR, Accurate, and Ramshot.

The problem with published data is that there is no SAAMI .44 Special +P and everything is "Nitro for Black" level, topping out at 14000 psi.

Brian Pearce dreamed up some alleged 22000 psi .44 loads but I do not see where he said his source of pressure tests.
https://www.handloadermagazine.com/44-s-w-special-p

[willie]

I do not see Unique or other Alliant powders on the Hodgdon site, just Hodgdon, Winchester, IMR, Accurate, and Ramshot.

The problem with published data is that there is no SAAMI .44 Special +P and everything is "Nitro for Black" level, topping out at 14000 psi.

Brian Pearce dreamed up some alleged 22000 psi .44 loads but I do not see where he said his source of pressure tests.
https://www.handloadermagazine.com/44-s-w-special-p

You are correct. Hodgdon does not include Alliant data which are available on Alliant's site. The source for my pressure comments about Unique is a forum member on the cast bullet forum that I frequent. He has his own pressure testing equipment. Too, he worked on the ballistics side of the shooting industry. @Outpost75 is another industry professional.

[revchuck38]

Alliant's web page is here. Their .44 Special loads with Unique are here.

[Malamute]

Ive used Unique quite a bit since the mid 70s, Ive loaded more pistol ammo with it than any other powder, and other than a few boxes of Keith type higher end 2400 loads is the only powder Ive used in 44 spl. It has a reputation for being somewhat dirty, that may be partly carbon, and may be partly unburned powder. It burns cleaner in mid pressure range loads than lower pressure range loads. The newer version is supposed to be a bit better, but I dont think Ive loaded any yet. Unique tends to leave the forcing cone area a bit frosted looking, which is probably the higher flame temp. I havent noticed any actual detrimental affects of it, meaning the gun not able to function or perform as it had earlier in its lifetime, but it may bother some people.

When dad gave me his loading stuff there was a couple lbs of Clays Universal powder. I called the company and asked for equivalent loads to the Unique loads i was shooting, in each instance they gave me the same charge weight in Universal to achieve the same velocity level, so Ive just gone with that in my limited use of it, and I like it for the most part. If I were starting out today Id probably go with the universal and call it good, and ill probably buy it in the future when i need more powder in the Unique class.

[358156hp]

Try this, you're likely to find something useful. Use at own risk, and so forth, and so on, and scooby, doobie, doobie. It may already be listed earlier in the thread, but I'm too lazy to read every post.

http://www.goodrichfamilyassoc.org/44_Special_Articles/

[Crazy Dane]

I do not see Unique or other Alliant powders on the Hodgdon site, just Hodgdon, Winchester, IMR, Accurate, and Ramshot.

The problem with published data is that there is no SAAMI .44 Special +P and everything is "Nitro for Black" level, topping out at 14000 psi.

Brian Pearce dreamed up some alleged 22000 psi .44 loads but I do not see where he said his source of pressure tests.
https://www.handloadermagazine.com/44-s-w-special-p

I have used the data from this article a lot to load for my GP100s. 2400 is my favorite powder to experiment with and I find that it is predictable and repeatable. Unique is easy, pick a load, go forth and prosper. These are the only 2 powders I stock* and use for straight walled pistol cartridges. I do keep a jug of W296 on hand if ever need magnum loads, if ever and Trail Boss for Powder puffs. My goal is a 250gn 429421 at 100 FPS in .44 Special.

CFE pistol runs very close to Unique but I could never find good accuracy with it.

HP-38 and HS-6 have been good for me but there isn't many experimenters using this and you are most likely be own your own creating +p loads. I have exceeded book levels but I don't feel comfortable sharing that data. It was easier to keep using 2400 and Unique than have the potential to screw-up badly.

* I plan to try BE-86 and H Universal to find a replacement for Unique as that supply seems to be nonexistent at this point.