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Thread: Scatter Gun Ammo

  1. #1
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    Scatter Gun Ammo

    Ok, question for you guys running a scattergun. I was doing some reading and saw that Winchester has a new defense shotgun load out, the PDX1. It is a standard 1oz lead slug with three 00 buck pellets (from pics they look copper plated) on top of it. The only pictures I saw were a 7 yard spread on paper. Anyone have any experience/opinions on this load?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeJumper View Post
    Ok, question for you guys running a scattergun. I was doing some reading and saw that Winchester has a new defense shotgun load out, the PDX1. It is a standard 1oz lead slug with three 00 buck pellets (from pics they look copper plated) on top of it. The only pictures I saw were a 7 yard spread on paper. Anyone have any experience/opinions on this load?
    I shot a PDX load out of a .410 a few weeks ago - I think it was three discs and some shot. The grouping was inconsistent. Some times it'd open up 1-1/2, sometimes it'd be one tiny hole on the target 15 yards away.

  3. #3
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    I checked it out and just couldn't really understand the concept. If you want a slug you want a slug for precision shooting, thus the buck becomes a problem. If you want the buck you want the effect of multiple rounds of buckshot hitting the target at the same time over an expanded area. Thus again only having 3 buckshot becomes a problem. Buck and slug are designed for different problems, and it seems this type of load reduces the effectiveness of the round in each specific problem rather than improving the effectiveness.
    "PLAN FOR YOUR TRAINING TO BE A REFLECTION OF REAL LIFE INSTEAD OF HOPING THAT REAL LIFE WILL BE A REFLECTION OF YOUR TRAINING!"

  4. #4
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    Yeah, I was just looking for anyone's experience. Slugs are meant to be slugs and buck shot is supposed to be just buck shot. I may get a box or two just for kicks to run through the Vang Comp.

  5. #5
    Member Tim's Avatar
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    It's an update to the old buck and ball loads that were popular with smooth bore muskets from the 16th through the middle part of the 19th Centuries.

    The theory being that you might very well miss your target with the round ball, but at least get some secondary hits with the buckshot.

    It made sense with the matchlock, flintlock, and smooth bore 69 cal. percussion muskets then in use, especially when infantry lined up in rows and set to murder the opposition at 30 paces.

    I don't think it makes a lot of sense in a modern service shotgun load. If you're looking for a "precision shot" or a load to defeat a barrier, get a good slug load that shoots well in your shotgun. If you are wanting a a good buckshot load for the Hammer of Thor lethatility that a shotgun is capable of, I'd recommend the Federal Tactical LE Flite Control 9 pellet 00 buck. It makes your shotgun pattern like a Vang Comp.

  6. #6
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    I don't like the idea of the Win PDX-1 load.

    I've tried Remington Express/Walmart 2.75 inch buck in a M-500 at 15 yards and I liked the spread it gave. About 9 to 10 inches.

    I have tried Federal F-127 00 & 000 which gave me about 7 to 9 inches of spread. Aiming at the center of a Q target, it didn't spread beyond the shoulders of the target at 50 feet.

    Considering how one of the virtues of a shotgun is spread, I don't want to slug & buck loading. I do not have a greater than 50 foot shot in my house, or from the house to the sidewalk, I'm content with buck.

    If I had to reach across the street? Slugs or F-127/LE-132 or 133

    At home, the slug would serve no purpose as nothing in my house can protect someone from buckshot at the distances involved, and even wit body armor...a person shot would end up as a potato chip bag - intact ouside, broken up inside. With the Federal 127 00 & 000 at 7 yards the patterns were smaller than the outline of a Q target's head, so decapitating someone is rather possible.

    For use across the street, I do not want to endanger people with random projectiles inherent in buckshot.

  7. #7
    Site Supporter DocGKR's Avatar
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    "and even wit body armor...a person shot would end up as a potato chip bag - intact outside, broken up inside."
    This is a common myth that is not accurate. There are quite a few folks who have been hit in their soft armor by buckshot yet have not suffered incapacitating injuries and were able to continue functioning without significant deficits...

  8. #8
    Site Supporter DocGKR's Avatar
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    For shotguns, I like Brenneke slugs, as most of the soft lead Foster type slugs are poor penetrators of intermediate barriers. Given Brenneke USA's recent QC issues and the unfortunate unavailability of true Rotweil Brennke loads in the U.S. currently, we are looking forward to trying the new Federal Truball Deep Penetrator (PB127 DPRS) slug load http://www.federalpremium.com/produc...ug.aspx?id=902) as a potential Brenneke replacement.

    I am VERY excited about Federal's long delayed decision to finally produce a good tactical #1 Buckshot load using the Flight Control Wad and reduced recoil loading; if done correctly, this will be the premier close range LE and personal defense shotgun load available.

    Otherwise, the Federal and Hornady 00 buckshot loads using the Chris Billings designed Choke™ shot spread reducing wad (ie. Flight Control and TAP), work well.

  9. #9
    Not a formal test, but illustrates the difference in buckshot patterns with different loads.
    http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot45.htm

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocGKR View Post
    #1 Buckshot load using the Flight Control Wad and reduced recoil loading
    DO WANT

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