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Thread: My First Foray into the World of Real Gel--9mn Loads

  1. #21
    Here is the method I followed. I'm not sure what might have gone wrong. I attempted to "calibrate" last night and a BB penetrated over six inches.

    Maybe the block wasn't adequately cooled. I'll try another BB this evening.

    BALLISTIC GELATIN MIXING PROCEDURES PRACTICED BY THE FBI

    In December 1988, the FBI Academy Firearms Training Unit (FTU) designed and implemented the FBI Ammunition Tests. The test designs are based on research and consultation with experts in the fields of wound
    ballistics, forensic pathology, wound research and medical research. The tissue simulant utilized in FBI ballistic tests is Vyse Ordinance Gelatin.

    The mixture is 10%, by weight. The mentioned research shows that properly calibrated 10% ordinance gelatin is a reliable tissue simulant. Calibration of ballistic gelatin is verified by firing a .177 steel BB at 590 feet per second (fps), plus or minus 15 fps, into the gelatin, resulting in 8.5 centimeters (cm), plus or minus 1 cm, penetration (2.95" – 3.74"). During FBI tests, any gelatin blocks, which fail the calibration test, are discarded. Calibration results are not published due to the Pass/Fail nature of the test.

    Mixing Gelatin
    The gelatin is mixed in the following manner (assuming a twenty-pound block is desired)
    1) Weigh out two (2) lbs. of gelatin powder and place aside

    2) Weigh out 18 lbs. of hot 60° C (140° F) water in a plastic bucket. (Note: The FBI utilizes a scale, which
    weighs to the nearest .01 lb)

    3) Place 2.5 ml of Foam Eater in water

    4) Place approximately .5 ml. of oil of cinnamon into water (prevents fungus growth)

    5) While utilizing a battery-operated drill with a mixing paddle attached, mix the water to the point of forming a whirlpool, without introducing air into the mixture

    6) While the water is being mixed, slowly add the gelatin powder

    7) Pour the mixture into a clean mold pan

    8) Allow to stand at room temperature for approximately 4 hours

    9) Write date on small square of cardboard and place on top of mixture

    10) Place pan with mixture into refrigerator set at 4° C (39.2° F)

    11) Allow curing for 36 hours (note: larger blocks require longer cure time. (e.g. an 80lb block requires 96
    hours to cure) Blocks, over time, deteriorate and are temperature sensitive. Former FBI publications advocated utilizing blocks within 20 minutes of removal from the refrigerator, a general statement pertaining to ambient temperature
    indoors). Allowable time outside the refrigerator is, however, relative to the temperature of the test environment (e.g. a block removed from a refrigerator and maintained in a room at the same temperature as the refrigerator will retain its calibration significantly longer than one placed outside on a hot summer day). Note: Some authorities believe mixing procedures may vary the consistency of gelatin. FBI studies indicate, however, that a block, which displays the required level of penetration, within the required velocity range, is a “valid” tissue simulant. The FBI Ballistic Research Facility conducts its tests in an environmentally controlled shooting laboratory. The blocks of gelatin are removed from the refrigerator and checked for calibration. Only valid blocks are used for test.

    Blocks used in testing of conventional pistol ammunition are approximately 6.25" X 6.25" X 16". The initial block of gelatin used in a test is referred to as “The Primary Block”. Each Primary Block is utilized for a maximum of five shots, one in each corner, approximately 1.75" from the nearest edge, and one in the center. Tests conducted by the FBI indicate this placement of shots results in substantially the same penetration as single shots into virgin blocks of gelatin. Any shots, which cross the wound path of previous shots, are re-fired. Primary blocks are not utilized for more than five shots, to include any shots, which are re-fired. Because some shots may penetrate more than one block of gelatin, one or more “stopper” blocks are placed behind the primary block. The stopper blocks may be utilized for more than one test, if the wound channels are not crossed. At the end of each test, the stopper block is placed back into the refrigerator while another stopper is utilized with an unused Primary block. Stopper blocks may receive more than five penetrations; if no wound channels are crossed, (e.g. a stopper, which has five penetrations of 3” into one end, can be flipped over and used as a subsequent “stopper.”) The FBI does not reuse gelatin. Used blocks are discarded.
    Last edited by Tokarev; 01-29-2018 at 11:25 AM.

  2. #22
    Okay, I have some good news and some bad news.

    First, the bad news. The gel has been in the refrigerator for a day and a night but won't solidify. It is no longer liquid but it wiggles and jiggles like some sort of high school cafeteria dessert. Validation with a BB results in something like six inches of penetration. A quick call to Now Foods (the maker of this particular grocery store brand) reveals that the Bloom is 150.

    The good news? I guess there is no good news other than I've learned that not all grocery store gel is the same. None of the retail packaging seems to include info on Bloom so it is basically a roll of the dice I guess. Or the good news can be that I've learned a powerful lesson and have decided to order a 10lb bag of powder from Custom Collagen.

    https://www.customcollagen.com/ballistic-gelatin/

    This should be the real stuff and will hopefully work well for me. I had been planning on getting some of this eventually anyway.

    Interestingly, I found an older YouTube video done by Andrew (Blue-Falcon on ar15.com) where he links a Now Foods gel product as the product he uses for his ammo testing.

  3. #23
    You should shoot it anyway just for fun.
    We could isolate Russia totally from the world and maybe they could apply for membership after 2000 years.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by 5pins View Post
    You should shoot it anyway just for fun.
    Maybe although I doubt I'll be able to recover any bullets. If a BB penetrates nearly halfway I imagine handgun ammo will pass completely through.

    Maybe I'll put some strawberries and whipped cream on it. Bring it into the office and see how many of my coworkers eat it.

    Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

  5. #25
    Sorry to hear it didn't work out. Since you already put time and effort into the block(s) have you thought about shooting them anyways just for data? How does a block like this compare to your earlier block of food grade gel and later to ordinance grade gel properly prepared? Does twice the validation BB penetration equal similar from projectiles from handgun/longuns? That kind of thing. Sometimes even a mistake or different test can yield useful information. Just a thought.

  6. #26
    Spray your gelatin mold with CRC silicon oil as a release agent before you pour in the gelatin solution. You can get it at Walmart for about $2.00/can - https://www.walmart.com/ip/CRC-Heavy...l-Can/16817419

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn Dodson View Post
    Spray your gelatin mold with CRC silicon oil as a release agent before you pour in the gelatin solution. You can get it at Walmart for about $2.00/can - https://www.walmart.com/ip/CRC-Heavy...l-Can/16817419
    I will absolutely give this a try. Thanks!

  8. #28
    Progress!

    Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

  9. #29
    I've just put another block in the refrigerator. This one is made from 250 bloom pork gel using the following techniques:

    I weighed out 1kg of powder and measured 9 liters of hot (about 130 degree) tap water. The water went into a 5-gal bucket. Powder was slowly added while the water was agitated/swirled using an electric drill and paint stirring bit. Time to add gel and stir until no clumps were seen was 10 minutes. The bucket was then allowed to sit for 20 minutes to allow the mix to settle and some of the foam to dissipate. The top layer of foam was gently scraped off then the mix was poured into the 6X16 mold that had been sprayed with silicon lube. The block was then covered with a cookie sheet and allowed to sit at room temperature for four hours.

    When first poured the mix had a slight amount of foam on top that has slowly dissipated as the gel has cooled. There are just a faint few residual bubbles on top now as the block goes into the fridge.

    The block will be in the mold until tomorrow at 6pm. I will then pull it from the mold and let it sit in the fridge for another 24 hours at least. Fingers crossed that this one will be a good one.

    The above is more for my own reference rather than for anyone to read. If the block turns out and I'm happy with it I'll use the steps listed above and/or modify as needed.

    Thanks!


    Last edited by Tokarev; 02-03-2018 at 07:57 PM.

  10. #30
    I have been thinking of giving real gel a try but my fridge is too small. Then I remembered, there's always room for jello.
    We could isolate Russia totally from the world and maybe they could apply for membership after 2000 years.

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