LE UOF Video thread

[blues]

When I went through the Academy "MMA style" was the hot newness for defensive tactics. "All fights go to the ground" was the anthem, and thus the vast majority of the training was about taking the suspect to the ground, sort of self-fulfilling prophecy training. This shows the dangers of going to the ground for LE. Appalling, yes, but let's be honest here. There was no serious attempt to injure the sergeant. They kicked him in the ass a couple of times, more "humiliation for him/showing off for us" posturing then a truly violent assault.

I'm not a huge fan of pepper spray, but when I've been on the ground with a suspect and approached by potentially hostile bystanders, spray seemed the best tactic.

I guess it would depend on which direction they approach you from when they're about to land a kick. If you have time to pepper spray the crowd while fighting off the perp...more power to you.

[BehindBlueI's]

I guess it would depend on which direction they approach you from when they're about to land a kick. If you have time to pepper spray the crowd while fighting off the perp...more power to you.

Spray is the one tool we have that's area denial. Watching the video, unless I missed it, there's no active swinging or attacking by the suspect either. I suspect that both the sergeant and the suspect were gassed at that point. A quick spray to the suspect's face and maybe he's not going anywhere too far even if you disengage. The goal at that point is probably getting to your feet since you can't defend yourself surrounded and on the ground.

[blues]

Spray is the one tool we have that's area denial. Watching the video, unless I missed it, there's no active swinging or attacking by the suspect either. I suspect that both the sergeant and the suspect were gassed at that point. A quick spray to the suspect's face and maybe he's not going anywhere too far even if you disengage. The goal at that point is probably getting to your feet since you can't defend yourself surrounded and on the ground.

Okay, we must've been talking past one another. I wasn't referring to the video, but rather the portion of your post..."when I've been on the ground with a suspect and approached by potentially hostile bystanders, spray seemed the best tactic". Your second post fleshed out what I was waiting for.

[AMC]

As an update on this case.....new DA has declined prosecution of the suspect for the assault on the officers. The DAs criminal investigation of the officers continues, however. They also declined prosecution of a suspect who assaulted two officers who were contacting him for a "sit/lie" violation (local ordinance prohibiting sitting/laying on the ground during certain hours). Officers were both injured, and the discharge sheet made clear that cases arising from "quality of life" actions will not be prosecuted. In other words, you take on a subject for drinking/crapping/being drunk in public, and it results is an assault on the officers.....no prosecution.

Combine this with a recent incident that resulted in the callout of the DAs Independent Investigation Bureau. Officers respond to a shooting call. Find victim down, suffering from gunshots, but he is also armed, gun in hand. Officers grab a shield, approach cautiously while covering downed suspect, secure his gun, then render aid. Under our policy, pointing a firearm is a reportable use of force that triggers a supervisors investigation. Because the officers "used force" and the person was hospitalized, some genius supervisor thought that meant ring the bell for the IIB.

We are about to make Baltimore look like an aggressive, proactive police department.

[blues]

@AMC You have my deepest sympathy. You deserve much better.

[FNFAN]

As an update on this case.....new DA has declined prosecution of the suspect for the assault on the officers. The DAs criminal investigation of the officers continues, however. They also declined prosecution of a suspect who assaulted two officers who were contacting him for a "sit/lie" violation (local ordinance prohibiting sitting/laying on the ground during certain hours). Officers were both injured, and the discharge sheet made clear that cases arising from "quality of life" actions will not be prosecuted. In other words, you take on a subject for drinking/crapping/being drunk in public, and it results is an assault on the officers.....no prosecution.

Combine this with a recent incident that resulted in the callout of the DAs Independent Investigation Bureau. Officers respond to a shooting call. Find victim down, suffering from gunshots, but he is also armed, gun in hand. Officers grab a shield, approach cautiously while covering downed suspect, secure his gun, then render aid. Under our policy, pointing a firearm is a reportable use of force that triggers a supervisors investigation. Because the officers "used force" and the person was hospitalized, some genius supervisor thought that meant ring the bell for the IIB.

We are about to make Baltimore look like an aggressive, proactive police department.

Is there a large percentage of officers who find this a refreshing and needed change in policy? Basically asking how many brain dead zombies in blue you have to work with. I can only ponder how this would effect the morale of folks who joined the department to do police work. Watch your back Brother.

[TheNewbie]

As an update on this case.....new DA has declined prosecution of the suspect for the assault on the officers. The DAs criminal investigation of the officers continues, however. They also declined prosecution of a suspect who assaulted two officers who were contacting him for a "sit/lie" violation (local ordinance prohibiting sitting/laying on the ground during certain hours). Officers were both injured, and the discharge sheet made clear that cases arising from "quality of life" actions will not be prosecuted. In other words, you take on a subject for drinking/crapping/being drunk in public, and it results is an assault on the officers.....no prosecution.

Combine this with a recent incident that resulted in the callout of the DAs Independent Investigation Bureau. Officers respond to a shooting call. Find victim down, suffering from gunshots, but he is also armed, gun in hand. Officers grab a shield, approach cautiously while covering downed suspect, secure his gun, then render aid. Under our policy, pointing a firearm is a reportable use of force that triggers a supervisors investigation. Because the officers "used force" and the person was hospitalized, some genius supervisor thought that meant ring the bell for the IIB.

We are about to make Baltimore look like an aggressive, proactive police department.

Unbelievable. Dennis Prager is correct that leftism, not liberalism, destroys every thing.

The innocent will suffer, and if I were a cop there I would do the minimum until I could make my escape. These politicians and those that voted for them are morally responsible for evil.

[AMC]

Is there a large percentage of officers who find this a refreshing and needed change in policy? Basically asking how many brain dead zombies in blue you have to work with. I can only ponder how this would effect the morale of folks who joined the department to do police work. Watch your back Brother.

There may be a handful of useless report takers who don't mind the new policies, the the overwhelming majority of officers have had their morale utterly destroyed. This is compounded by the total silence of our Command staff on all of these incidents.

As for me, I'm a Training Division pogue now. My fights are with those in our department who think the Ranges only job is to run quals....not to provide training.

[FNFAN]

There may be a handful of useless report takers who don't mind the new policies, the the overwhelming majority of officers have had their morale utterly destroyed. This is compounded by the total silence of our Command staff on all of these incidents.

As for me, I'm a Training Division pogue now. My fights are with those in our department who think the Ranges only job is to run quals....not to provide training.

Well, that's a positive. They haven't yet started selecting out candidates that might hold troublesome values. Good luck with the training post! Sounds like that commercial with the guy that says, "No, I'm no a Security Guard, I'm a Security Monitor." Some places want a Range Officer and some want a Firearms Trainer. IIRC your state's pension system is highly portable if it goes to shite.

[Mark D]

....new DA has declined prosecution of the suspect for the assault on the officers.

This state is heading for serious problems.