Sig P365 - Single Stack 9mm w/10+1 and 12+1

[Dismas316]

Well, personally my 365 is an epic failure. Completely unreliable. Today experienced my 2nd episode of a dead trigger, this after sig had already replaced my firing pin once already.

Some quick background. Born date is 3/23. Experienced multiple failures to extract during the first 1000 rounds and than around the 1200 mark had the dreaded dead trigger. Sent back to Sig, they replaced the firing pin and all was going pretty well until today. I have put just over 1100 rounds on the new striker with only one malfunction. Actually today I was intending to consider it reliable as a carry option, and into my first mag, experienced another dead trigger. Checked to make sure it was in battery and it was. I also began to experience for the first time failure to lock back after the last round. This happened mulitple times shooting one handed so it was not me that was inducing the problem. Then about 40 rounds into it, another dead trigger. 365 is Done. It goes back to sig tomorrow and probably won’t see the light of day again.

It really give me a whole new appreciate for my 43. I actually preferred everything about it over the 365 with the exception of capacity. The 365 certainly has the right idea and concept but sadly, not ready for prime time imo. Thought I would run some drills with the two to see how they stacked up against each other. Well that turned out to be a no brainer. I new as a beta tester, especially with a sig, I was taking a chance. Well I should have known better, never again with sig. Good luck to those who choose to carry this, I certainly hope your lottery luck is better than mine. I just could never have confidence in it.

[vaspence]

Just returned from the range. The P365 has shot another 200 rounds of Fed 115 brass FMJ bringing it's current total to 1216 rounds with no issues.

[critter]

Well, personally my 365 is an epic failure. Completely unreliable. Today experienced my 2nd episode of a dead trigger, this after sig had already replaced my firing pin once already.
...

Just for clarification... is this yet another broken striker? Or is it the broken spring which renders the trigger itself inoperable (unless, apparently, held upside down)? Or something else?

[Dismas316]

Just for clarification... is this yet another broken striker? Or is it the broken spring which renders the trigger itself inoperable (unless, apparently, held upside down)? Or something else?

Not a broken striker. I have sent if back to sig and it’s quit possible they replace it. I suspect it may be a trigger spring issue but not sure. It’s possible that it could have even just been light primer strikes. At less than a box of ammo, I was having mulitple issues as I mentioned and honestly loss patience with the gun. I used Fiocchi 115g and lawman 147 and I ended up shooing about 250 rounds that day with my g 43 and as usual ran like a champ with the same ammo.

In the end it could have been other issues other then the gun itself such as ammo, maybe the magazines, (not locking back). All together for me, the gun is not reliable to run smoothly. I’ve run over 2000 rounds with it at least 10 different malfunction issues from FTE, dead triggers, not locking back after last round, not going into battery, etc. It’s been sent back once and on its way for a second time. When I get it back it’s likely getting sold.

[KhanRad]

I brought enough ammo to the range today to run the P365 to the 1000rd mark. This was a nasty day in the low 100s with blowing dust. 200rds of Winchester 124gr FMJ, 100rds of American Eagle 147gr FMJ, and 100rds of Speed G2 147gr JHP. I forgot to mention that I disassembled the pistol after purchase, cleaned it, oiled points of friction, and after the first 100rds I put TW-25b on the areas that showed silvering or areas I am familiar with being key points of friction on the Sig classic series. I have not cleaned it or lubed it since. I have about 20 years of experience running and working on classic Sigs.

I did a number of training drills to get my speed up like the F.A.S.T., casino, and some misc Gabe White drills. However, I started off banging the 8" plate rack at 10yrds from from a Tulster IWB holster. Even though it is no doubt a tiny 9mm, I was still able to hit the first plate out of the holster in 1.25s after warming up, and was able to knock down all 6 plates in under 3.5s(usually I am around 3.25s with a full sized pistol). So, once you get your grip right on it, it can be a very controllable fast little gun but obviously not as controllable as larger gun.

My reloads took some getting used to as that very short magazine and grip often catches on the base of my hand during ejection. With some practice I got my hand out of the way and my reloading drills sped up to acceptable levels. I definitely prefer the 10rd mag with extended base plate as it gives better control on the gun. I put in an order for a 12rd mag, but it hasn't come in yet. I did have 3 failures to lock back on the last round fired in the mag throughout the 1000rd test, but I am positive that this occurred with my thumb position. The gun is so tiny, it is easy for someone with average sized hands to impede its operation with a non compatible grip. I've found that the best grip is to ride the gun high(higher than your average Sig), so that your thumbs are up against the slide and out of the way of the slide lock lever. In my experience, provided that the slide is clear of obstruction, riding these tiny guns with a high grip often makes the gun run more reliably. The mechanical function of feeding and ejection appears to be a very good design. No failures to extract as of yet, but then again I am running brass or nickel coated brass cases from reputable American manufacturers.

As I mentioned in my previous post, the scratching on the magazines has stopped. I only noticed scratching on the magazine that shipped with the gun and after a few insertions the scratching stopped. I have noticed that there is a tiny dimple on the right rear of the magazine near the top which seems to occur as the magazine bumps up against the metal internal frame as the gun recoils. However, it doesn't seem to be getting any worse as the round count goes up.


I don't think I will be totally satisfied until the gun has reached 2000rds given the past history of this model. However, if I do keep things in perspective, in the under 20oz weight class I have only routinely used a Sig P230/P232 and a S&W 642 as BUGs and gym-clothes guns over the years. Even my old W. German P230s and P232s have never made it to 1000rds without a dozen mechanical and shooter induced failures. My two S&W 642s were more reliable, but both guns ran into timing issues and cylinder rotation issues prior to the 1000rd mark due to the more dust exposure from being carried in an ankle holster on duty.

[GJM]

Supply may be starting to catch up with demand, as the LGS had a new one in the case yesterday. Felt good in the hands, I like the sights, the trigger had some roll, and felt very good. I asked the sales guy what their experience was, and he said they had sold one, and the customer got thru ten rounds when the "striker broke."

[HCountyGuy]

Seriously, what’s it going to take for Sig to get their act together? I hate that they’re getting “rewarded” with continued contracts despite glaring problems continually being reported.

Have there been any additional problems from the P320 adopters, from LEOs to the Military? I’m hoping Sig at least paid attention to the details with their guns, but given reports from others on this board I’m reasonable skeptical.

[willie]

Some of these posts remind me about my experiences with KelTec pistols. I had faith that they would get things right but was disappointed. I think that the manufacturing end of the process can screw up even good designs. One example is the Remington 870 which is simplicity itself. Another is the old Marlin lever gun line of rifles. Most likely bean counters have something to do with manufacturing failures.

[KhanRad]

Seriously, what’s it going to take for Sig to get their act together? I hate that they’re getting “rewarded” with continued contracts despite glaring problems continually being reported.

Have there been any additional problems from the P320 adopters, from LEOs to the Military? I’m hoping Sig at least paid attention to the details with their guns, but given reports from others on this board I’m reasonable skeptical.

One thing to remember is that Sig is currently using the Remington manufacturing model where police and military contract models are of higher quality than civilian commercial models. Before Ron Cohen took over SigArms in 2005, Sig produced guns for both LE/Mil and the civilian market of the same high quality level. I own almost a dozen guns from that era both contract and civilian and they are indistinguishable in terms of quality. When Cohen took over, all the guns went to crap.......I guess this would be considered the Kel Tec model? Civilians went to crap, but so did our LE contract guns......so much so that my agency was desperate to find a way to piggy back onto another agency contract for Glock .40s or HK2000 .40s. As has been observed by many in LE, the training instructor world, and Sig Sauer reps themselves, Sig changed their business model around 2012 to improve quality.

However, even with quality improvements in the last 5 years it is still the Remington Model. Our post 2012 classic contract Sigs are holding up quite well, as well as our P320s. Sig released the LE contract SKU P365s in July, which is why I bought it for my own testing.

Personally, I would never buy a civilian Sig on the commercial market now days. I am willing to buy IOP contract guns from Sig since they are the only maker I am authorized to carry from. However, if I was not in LE and was unable to purchase an IOP Sig, I would never consider getting a Sig in the first place. I would buy from a maker that has a better reputation for quality civilian products like Glock or H&K.

[psalms144.1]

One thing to remember is that Sig is currently using the Remington manufacturing model where police and military contract models are of higher quality than civilian commercial models.

Well, I would beg to differ on that, as there are COUNTLESS instances of crappy QC and issues with LE and .mil contract guns. I wouldn't buy any modern production Sig, and I wouldn't want a contract gun. Just because .mil guns MIGHT have different requirements, doesn't mean the QUALITY is any better...