New 11# Beretta Hammer Springs Coming!

[LangdonTactical]

So I just returned from a really long range session of testing the 11# springs. I chose to shoot IMI NATO ball and Federal AE as my test ammo. The IMI as it is the hardest factory primers I have and the AE as it has the softest (hardest to ignite and easiest to ignite).

Now, this is a relatively small sample size, so the numbers are just a start at this point.

I will start with the 92. I started with an M9A1 with a Wilson Trigger bar and Elite II hammer. I had three light strikes out of 100 rounds of IMI. All but one fired with the second strike.

I changed to Federal 115 AE, and the gun was 100% with this ammo. Not really surprising.

I then changed the hammer out in the 92 to a standard PX4 hammer. Again, I had three light strikes with the IMI ammo, and two of them would not go with the second strike.

Again, the 92 was 100% with Federal AE. Maybe a little surprising as the PX4 hammer is lighter than the Elite II hammer. Theoretically, it should be less reliable.

I then switched to the Wilson Combat Hammer for the 92. Heavier than the Elite II hammer but lighter than the standard stock hammer. I had 4 light strikes with the Wilson Hammer and two of those did not fire with the second strike. So, not a significate difference and given the small testing batch, within the margin of error for this size of testing.

It is interesting that the gun hand a 3% to 4% failure rate regardless of hammer weight and that the 4% was with the heaviest hammer. But again, we are just getting started with testing.

Again, the gun was 100% with the Federal Ammo.

Now, the PX4 with a standard weight PX4 hammer (the lightest one available) was 100% with the IMI ammo. On top of that, it fired all the rounds that failed to fire in the 92 on the second strike.

This is important as I really think this hammer spring will be 100% in the PX4. When I take into account that I put 50,000 rounds through a single gun with a single 12# hammer spring, I knew we could go a little lighter on the hammer spring in the PX4 and still be 100%.

Also, the difference in hammer strut geometry is very clear between the two guns and it shows in this test. The hammer spring in the standard PX4 is much lighter than the standard 92 spring. I have not measured, but I would guess the standard PX4 hammer spring is close to a 14# hammer spring, maybe a 13.5# spring.

This is very clear in the DA trigger pull measurements between the two guns with the 11# hammer spring. The 92 dropped down to 5.5 lbs in DA, maybe just under that. Where the PX4 is more like 6.5 lbs. Maybe just a little less. The 92 DA is just magical with this 11# spring. So much so that it is kind of hard to believe it will light primers at all. The PX4 DA is great for sure, but not nearly as light and smooth as the 92.

This also confirms my personal belief that you can get away with the 12# hammer spring on the 92 in a carry gun, IF, you will stick with Federal ammo. I know you are pushing the limits, but the 92 appears to be 100% with federal ammo and the 11# hammer spring, at least so far.

Again, this is just the start of this testing. We have a lot more ammo to shoot before I can trust the numbers.

I am looking forward to hearing the results of the others that now have these springs. We shipped about 60 springs last week. So the results should start coming in soon.

[AdioSS]

How about a standard heavy hammer?

[CraigS]

I just tried my 11# spring today in my EII w/ the LTT trigger job in a bag.. Using Federal aluminum case ammo from Walmart. Had 5- light strikes in the first 50 rounds. They were all in SA mode and they all fired when I pulled the trigger again in DA mode. Put my 12# back in the gun. I don't know if the primers in this Walmart ammo are the same as other types of Federal or not. I shot my last 50 rnds of the day from my PX4c w/ 'D' spring. One thing I noticed immediately was I really like the wide face of the PX4 trigger, especially in DA shots..

[LangdonTactical]

How about a standard heavy hammer?

I have not tried that yet, but it is on the list to try.

[LangdonTactical]

I just tried my 11# spring today in my EII w/ the LTT trigger job in a bag.. Using Federal aluminum case ammo from Walmart. Had 5- light strikes in the first 50 rounds. They were all in SA mode and they all fired when I pulled the trigger again in DA mode. Put my 12# back in the gun. I don't know if the primers in this Walmart ammo are the same as other types of Federal or not. I shot my last 50 rnds of the day from my PX4c w/ 'D' spring. One thing I noticed immediately was I really like the wide face of the PX4 trigger, especially in DA shots..

So the first question is, does that same ammo go 100% with the 12# spring?

I did not even know that Federal was making Aluminum cased ammo, never seen that before. So, maybe it is different primers, I really don't know.

The 11# spring is really built for the PX4, not the 92. For sure it is over the edge on the 92, but doable with the right primers. A competition Hammer Spring for sure.

Thanks for posting your results.

[CraigS]

So the first question is, does that same ammo go 100% with the 12# spring?

I did not even know that Federal was making Aluminum cased ammo, never seen that before. So, maybe it is different primers, I really don't know.

The 11# spring is really built for the PX4, not the 92. For sure it is over the edge on the 92, but doable with the right primers. A competition Hammer Spring for sure.

Thanks for posting your results.

It's funny that I don't see the alum case Federal on their website but I have been buying it for maybe 6 months. Screaming deal at $17.79/100 rnds. They also have brass for about a dollar more. The ammo runs about 99% w/ the 12# spring. I got 3 light strikes in maybe 1000 rnds but the last 2 were closer together. So I put in a new 12# spring and a few days later installed my LTT TJIB. Shot maybe 150 rnds and then the 11# spring arrived so I had to try it. 300 rnds today. 50 w/ the 11# and then 250 w/ the 12#. The 250 were perfect. The PX4c is a carry gun so I haven't gone lighter than the 'D' but your comments above make me think I should try a 12# or 13# in it.
BTW have you ever had any trouble w/ the backstraps on the PX4? I guess the steel spring is the final retention but it seems like I am butchering the plastic slots and tabs every time I remove it.

[MSparks909]

EL I am not, but the lightest that *I* feel comfortable using in a 92 is a 13# spring. I’ll run a 12# in my PX4s. Might experiment with the 11# eventually.

[medmo]

Got back home last night and found the 11# spring waiting for me. Ran a comparison with it and the other Px4 springs I have in my Compact Carry this morning. I started a thread earlier today posting the results. 10 samples averaged and the data looks like this:8

Wilson 12# Chrome Silicon
DA - 6.53, SA - 2.57
Beretta Factory Spring
DA - 8.66, SA - 2.97
Beretta Factory D Spring
DA - 8.55, SA - 2.89
Langdon Tactical 11#
DA - 6.08, SA - 2.19

The 11# spring is a keeper. Will be running a few hundred rounds through the pistol over the weekend to confirm reliability.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

So I just returned from a really long range session of testing the 11# springs. I chose to shoot IMI NATO ball and Federal AE as my test ammo. The IMI as it is the hardest factory primers I have and the AE as it has the softest (hardest to ignite and easiest to ignite).

Now, this is a relatively small sample size, so the numbers are just a start at this point.

I will start with the 92. I started with an M9A1 with a Wilson Trigger bar and Elite II hammer. I had three light strikes out of 100 rounds of IMI. All but one fired with the second strike.

I changed to Federal 115 AE, and the gun was 100% with this ammo. Not really surprising.

I then changed the hammer out in the 92 to a standard PX4 hammer. Again, I had three light strikes with the IMI ammo, and two of them would not go with the second strike.

Again, the 92 was 100% with Federal AE. Maybe a little surprising as the PX4 hammer is lighter than the Elite II hammer. Theoretically, it should be less reliable.

I then switched to the Wilson Combat Hammer for the 92. Heavier than the Elite II hammer but lighter than the standard stock hammer. I had 4 light strikes with the Wilson Hammer and two of those did not fire with the second strike. So, not a significate difference and given the small testing batch, within the margin of error for this size of testing.

It is interesting that the gun hand a 3% to 4% failure rate regardless of hammer weight and that the 4% was with the heaviest hammer. But again, we are just getting started with testing.

Again, the gun was 100% with the Federal Ammo.

Now, the PX4 with a standard weight PX4 hammer (the lightest one available) was 100% with the IMI ammo. On top of that, it fired all the rounds that failed to fire in the 92 on the second strike.

This is important as I really think this hammer spring will be 100% in the PX4. When I take into account that I put 50,000 rounds through a single gun with a single 12# hammer spring, I knew we could go a little lighter on the hammer spring in the PX4 and still be 100%.

Also, the difference in hammer strut geometry is very clear between the two guns and it shows in this test. The hammer spring in the standard PX4 is much lighter than the standard 92 spring. I have not measured, but I would guess the standard PX4 hammer spring is close to a 14# hammer spring, maybe a 13.5# spring.

This is very clear in the DA trigger pull measurements between the two guns with the 11# hammer spring. The 92 dropped down to 5.5 lbs in DA, maybe just under that. Where the PX4 is more like 6.5 lbs. Maybe just a little less. The 92 DA is just magical with this 11# spring. So much so that it is kind of hard to believe it will light primers at all. The PX4 DA is great for sure, but not nearly as light and smooth as the 92.

This also confirms my personal belief that you can get away with the 12# hammer spring on the 92 in a carry gun, IF, you will stick with Federal ammo. I know you are pushing the limits, but the 92 appears to be 100% with federal ammo and the 11# hammer spring, at least so far.

Again, this is just the start of this testing. We have a lot more ammo to shoot before I can trust the numbers.

I am looking forward to hearing the results of the others that now have these springs. We shipped about 60 springs last week. So the results should start coming in soon.

Were all the light strikes on DA?

[LangdonTactical]

Were all the light strikes on DA?

No, all the light strikes were not on DA. I did not keep track, but I would say it was 50/50.

Rememeber that I was using the Wilson Trigger bar, which cocks the hammer back to almost the SA point, farther than the standard trigger bar for sure.