Which is ironic, since the .40 S&W was developed to "tame" the 10mm that was too hard on guns and shooters - imagine if, instead of chasing a magic round, the time and effort had been put into developing better bullet technology way back in the late 80s...Originally Posted by Bucky
Precisely. Since hitting the target is paramount, terminal ballistics mean precisely zero if that's not done. Terminally speaking, .40 is very well suited for 4" pistol defense against human attackers. However, if something more imminently "persuasive" is needed then I would go to a .308 or .30-06 instead of anything you can easily hold in your hand.
However, you do see it time and time again, people claiming that they are in fact ballistacally or terminally equivalent in all aspects.
As for "it doesn't matter", well it doen't until it does. Statistically it doesn't, but that one time when a little more is needed, it's there or it's not. However, the consensus seems to be (and probably rightfully so) that the downsides in preparing for that highly statistically improbably doesn't warrant its use. Even more so for non LE carriers.
That's actually not true. The 10mm Lite was made to tame the 10mm. The .40 was created to fit the 10mm Lite into a 9mm size / framed pistol, which would undo some of both the tameness and wear factor on the guns.
It's ironic that many feel the .40 is "snappier" than the .45 ACP. From one point of view it is, because of the vast majority of what guns are chambered in .40. However apples to apples, in my opinion my .40 1911 shoots noticeably softer than my .45 ACP 1911. But then recoil can be subjective, YMMV.
Hall and Patrick chose "10 mm lite" because it outperformed .45 ACP and showed no significant terminal deficit compared to 10mm.That's actually not true. The 10mm Lite was made to tame the 10mm. The .40 was created to fit the 10mm Lite into a 9mm size / framed pistol, which would undo some of both the tameness and wear factor on the guns.
It's ironic that many feel the .40 is "snappier" than the .45 ACP. From one point of view it is, because of the vast majority of what guns are chambered in .40. However apples to apples, in my opinion my .40 1911 shoots noticeably softer than my .45 ACP 1911. But then recoil can be subjective, YMMV.
The 2 more rounds of 9mm vs. .40 in my carry Glock 19 probably won't matter either - unless they do. Given the similarity in terminal ballistics, capacity alone is pretty compelling.
Well, that, and the 21 round Magpul GL9 spare magazine in the weak side cargo pocket of my Vertx pants.
And the fact that I load 10's of thousands of 9mm's each year at < $0.10 ea on my automated Dillon 1050.
OK, enough fun. I'd break out my old G27/Extended Mag (size of G19/G23) and time myself occasionally. I could shoot it pretty fast and accurate, relatively speaking - but I get to shoot a lot. Most don't. Edit: And most people who don't shoot a lot SUCK with a 40, mostly because of flinching and a lack of recoil management. I actually enjoyed what I perceived as a faster cycle time on the slide. But when I checked the timer - the results didn't show that I was any faster. Still, I hung on. Until one day I just couldn't justify it any longer. It took a while to find the right price points (try to sell .40 lately???) but eventually I divested and have never looked back.
Last edited by GuanoLoco; 12-21-2017 at 02:11 PM.
Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Doodie Project?
Are there any reputable statistics on the issue of caliber and probability of incapacitation?
Not too much to add for me from what others posted. I played around with several .40 options (CZ, Glocks in all sizes, HK USP, 3rd Gen S&W, XD, etc.) before I bought settled on 9mm. For me, the only reason I'd go to .40 S&W is for Major scoring in USPSA.
I'll likely pick up a G22 or G23 at some point just to have a .40S&W weapon in case of unavailability of 9mm ammo or a need for a .40 for some reason.
That's a highly unlikely potential advantage for 9mm, but if having 17/ 9mm rounds instead of 15/ .40 rounds is deemed "compelling" then that's certainly a reason for 9mm preference, even though 15 rounds of .40 has more tissue disruption potential than 17 rounds of 9mm.
Last edited by QED; 12-21-2017 at 02:17 PM.
I don't see a point in selling my 4006 either. Now tell me more about this cheap, police trade in ammunition.
