Page 9 of 9 FirstFirst ... 789
Results 81 to 85 of 85

Thread: 357 Sig question

  1. #81
    I always love a good caliber thread. When I go hunting I still take a 10mm not a 9mm, although I did have to kill a charging boar with a 9mm and it did it rather well. I'd suppose if my shot placement wasn't excellent it would have been different, or a larger pig.

    My take away from all the excellent info is, if the bullet isn't traveling at least around 2200 fps then shot placement is the most crucial element of being successful. If the bullet is going over 2200 fps then we can have a slightly worse shot placement and still have a pretty good chance of surviving.

    Although now we get to shotguns, which are still devastating at close range provided it isn't birdshot. So where does that devastation come from? Is it more just from multiple projectiles at once?

  2. #82
    Beyond freedom n' dignity Baldanders's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondering Beard View Post
    If you're looking at bullets like rocks to throw then sure, bigger and heavier makes sense. However, rocks aren't meant to penetrate flesh and hit vitals. It's a very different way of putting a dangerous person down.

    So, I understand where you come from but the comparison isn't really apt. I would say that if you start thinking of pistol (not rifle) bullets like daggers that you can launch from a distance instead of stabbing at bad breath distance (though with very similar effects) and then start thinking of what type of dagger you want for that purpose, you'd be closer to how wound ballistics work.

    P.S. I'm not advocating for needle like bullets, but rather for penetration to the vitals.
    When I am trying to explain to non-gun nuts why Hollywood's portrayal of guns is often dumb, I usually say something like "it's a ranged icepick, not a ranged hammer."

    Horrible confession time: 20 years back, my first carry piece was a Glock 33 with a MagSafe in the pipe!

    Also, I thought Marshall and Sanow had some validity. People can change, just usually not quickly.
    Floor rid uh born, by no one's grace

  3. #83
    Gray Hobbyist Wondering Beard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    The Coterie Club
    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    When I am trying to explain to non-gun nuts why Hollywood's portrayal of guns is often dumb, I usually say something like "it's a ranged icepick, not a ranged hammer."

    Horrible confession time: 20 years back, my first carry piece was a Glock 33 with a MagSafe in the pipe!

    Also, I thought Marshall and Sanow had some validity. People can change, just usually not quickly.
    My first gun was a G19 gen 2 purchased within a year or so of its appearance in the US (a pretty lucky choice considering that I had been taken to the range just once before and knew nothing about guns).

    Once I learned a little, I was "high velocity is king!" and "high speed hollow points hit flesh and magic happens and bad guy goes down!".

    Once I learned more, I was "357 Magnum 125 gr JHP is what the 9mm wants to be when it grows up!"

    I learned a bit more and I was "1911 Gov't model, 45 ACP, end of discussion!"

    Then: "40 S&W! Best of both worlds!" in a G23, of course.

    Well, fast forward quite a few years of training, practice, actually seeing ammo tested in gelatin and getting to learn from people who actually know what they're talking about and I look at my handguns as tools to poke holes in bad people. I just want the holes to be in the right place and get to the right stuff, the rest (which is just about everything) is fighting and what's in my gun, so long as it works, doesn't matter quite as much anymore.
    “An ill-educated person behaves with arrogant impatience, whereas truly profound education breeds humility.” Alexander Solzhenitsyn
    "There are problems in this universe for which there are no answers." Paul Muad'dib

  4. #84
    LE Forum Moderator BehindBlueI's's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Midwest
    Quote Originally Posted by 10mmfanboy View Post
    So where does that devastation come from? Is it more just from multiple projectiles at once?
    Yes, just like your muscles have limited capability based on time and load the body's ability to deal with injury is limited based on time and amount of damage to compensate for. Your body is designed to fight injured and can change blood flow patterns, etc while under fight-or-flight response but it can be overwhelmed (obviously) and more injuries are harder to deal with. Note you still have to hit something that matters, you just get more chances with it. More chances of getting a major blood vessel, doing more damage to organs than they can compensate for, etc.
    L'otters are not afraid.
    WWOMJD?

    Quote Originally Posted by UNM1136 View Post
    Maybe with talented students I would lube up with baby oil and then go at it.

  5. #85
    Murder Machine, Harmless Fuzzball TCinVA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Virginia
    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    Yes, just like your muscles have limited capability based on time and load the body's ability to deal with injury is limited based on time and amount of damage to compensate for. Your body is designed to fight injured and can change blood flow patterns, etc while under fight-or-flight response but it can be overwhelmed (obviously) and more injuries are harder to deal with. Note you still have to hit something that matters, you just get more chances with it. More chances of getting a major blood vessel, doing more damage to organs than they can compensate for, etc.
    All of that. Plus tissue can only stretch so much...and when it is challenged at multiple points at the same time the stretch capacity at each individual pressure point is now reduced by however other many pressure points exist. If a tissue can stretch for 100 arbitrarily assigned points and now you challenge it at 10 points of pressure those 100 points get divided up between all of them. And so tissue tears much more readily, which dramatically increases tearing of tissue resulting from a single press of the trigger.

    Rifles are more effective than pistols because they cause a TSC that is big enough to tear tissue instead of just stretch it, and as a result their TSC is a significant wounding factor.

    Buckshot takes the tearing and puts it on steroids...assuming the pattern is good enough.
    Last edited by TCinVA; 09-05-2019 at 11:47 AM.
    3/15/2016

User Tag List

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •